10,4mm Chamelot-Delvigne Modello 1874


#1

Hello, this is my first post.
I have 10,4 mm Chamelot-Delvigne Modello 1874 round.
I would like to identify the A-C T - 92 * headstamp.
What does the star mean?

Thanks for reading this, any help is appreciated.

Sergio


#2

Hola Sergio, ¡que bueno verte por acá!

The star indicates a case having a Berdan primer pocket.

Un abrazo grande,

Fede


#3

Thank you very much Fede

Sergio


#4

T 91(?) Torino (Turin) 1891 Italy.

The Turin Artillery Arsenal had also an Ammunition Plant attached ( in the Dora Industrial District , in Northern Turin.) Factory Buildings were still standing when I was in Turin, 1974-83…since then have been re-developed into residential areas. The original “Arsenale” in the Centre of the City is still the HQ of the Artillery Service and other Military Commands ( “Ordnance” to US Speakers)

A.C. Inspector’s Initials (Surname First, First Name Last) ID ???

Cartridge Interchangeable with the M1889 Glisenti /Bodeo Cartridge.
The M74 cartridge was originally BP, but converted to smkeless when the M89 Revolver was introduced. The Cartridge was further upgraded with a Jacketed/Plated Bullet in 1899. ( as was the Vetterli Bullet)

Most of these cases were originally Boxer-style Priming, but the Berdan priming was introduced sometime in the early 1890s.

10,4 Vetterli cases continued Boxer priming quite a bit longer, and the “Components” supplied by the US during WW I were also Boxer primed.


#5

Hello Sergio,
Basing on the book “culots de munitions”,
there is an inspector with A.C initials :“Adamo Cavallo”, but on “Bologne” case product.


#6

Laurent - Are you sure of that identification? “A.C.” as it appears on an Italian-generated list, and the most complete list I have seen, is shown as an Unknown Inspector at Bologna in the 1890s. “C.A.” is Afredo Cavalli and is much later, and found on both products of Bologna and Capua.

These initials are usually used with the last name (initial) given first, and then the first name (initial) give after it. So, for example, “C.A.” is Cavalli, Alfredo. Some sources show the name as “Cavallo, Alfredo.”

I wish the Italian Government would declassify this ancient information. The last word I had from out Italian friends is that this information is still coonsidered “secret” by the Italian Government. You would think they would declassify at least the names of the pre-1946 inspectors.

Similar to the name you gave, there was “A.A.” which was Aldo, Adamo, at Capua. No dates given.

Just wondered what the source of your information was? The list I use appeared on the IAA Forum of January 16, 2007, posted by Vittorio, who seems to be quite expert on Italian Ammunition.


#7

Thank you all,
Hopefully some Italian collector help us.
Sergio


#8

Italian Ammuniton Inspectors did move about quite a bit; sometimes in a particular year, they could be assigned to different Factories, hence the “doubling” of appearances at two different factories. Only very senior inspectors seem to have “Tenure” at a particular Plant for a longer time period.

Regards,
Doc AV


#9

[quote=“JohnMoss”]Laurent - Are you sure of that identification? “A.C.” as it appears on an Italian-generated list, and the most complete list I have seen, is shown as an Unknown Inspector at Bologna in the 1890s. “C.A.” is Afredo Cavalli and is much later, and found on both products of Bologna and Capua.

Just wondered what the source of your information was? The list I use appeared on the IAA Forum of January 16, 2007, posted by Vittorio, who seems to be quite expert on Italian Ammunition.[/quote]

Hello John,
I found this information in :
“culots de munitions” by S.Jorion and P.Regenstrief.


#10

" AA" ( for Aldo Adamo) was used from 1926 to 1940 on Capua headstamps.

“AC” is still unknown to my knowledge


#11

Pivi & Laurent - I think what we are seeing here is some confusion between A.C. and C.A. caused by the use of the last name first. I know that there is no confusion on that with Pivi or other Italian Collectors, and none from me, because I learned about this usage early on, in Italy.

I think there is also a mixing of two names into one, appearing on this thread. Note the use of “Adamo Cavallo” for A.C. when actually there is an Aldo, ADAMO using the initials A.A., and Cavalli, ALFREDO, using the initials C.A.


#12

Wellcome to the forum, mi buen amigo Sergio.

Saludos