14.5 x 114 Ball? in Libya

I saw this photo in a news article about the situation in Libya. Apparently it is of anti-Gaddafi rebels.

I found it interesting that the guy on the rear left appears to have a belt of just 14.5mm ball rounds (or rounds with no colour tips) over his shoulder. I didn’t think 14,5 x 114 Ball was widely used, or that much of it was ever made. I have certainly only ever seen AP, API and APIT examples. Is it possible that Libya manufactures it? It is interesting to think that there could be a whole new range of Libyan headstamps that were previously unknown.

Also, notice the guy at the back with the Carcano cavalry carbine.

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I prefer the BHP and Sterling.

Falcon, you are right! There are no 14.5x114 ball loads (except maybe civilian loads which do not matter).
I’d go here for North Korean APIs which do exist without markings.

There are news reports of British and US mil. intel. people entering Eastern Libya. Perhaps they will provide some information in time.

EOD beat me to it, but I agree that it could be North Korean API, known with lacquered steel cases and no tip color. No doubt one rogue state trading with another… Oil for ammunition maybe?

AKMS

I’m sure our Ex Prime Minister Tony Blair had something to do with the Sterling. He made alot of money for himself in corrupt dealings with Gaddafi.

[quote=“Falcon”]I’m sure our Ex Prime Minister Tony Blair had something to do with the Sterling. He made alot of money for himself in corrupt dealings with Gaddafi.[/quote]He might equally have something to do with the Hi-Power wielded by one of the men in one of the pictures here:
http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2011/02/libya_unrest_and_uncertainty.html
Another of the pictures show men holding links, probably from the 14,5 mm fired at demonstrators just before. Theres even a pic of a guy holding an L1A1 though one missing its forearm. (Is it called that on an SLR?)
Soren

Here are a bunch of recent press photos from Libya showing rebels / protesters & munitions. Maybe some of these will be of interest to collectors? I know Libya has had some odd sources over the years, including North Korea.

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looks to be faint traces of black tip color on a few rds (14.5?) :
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wwwgreenwichtimecom

Barely visible, but every fifth rd looks to be API here:
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crates full of spam cans (7.62x54?):
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The caption from this photo read “citizens hold grenades which were used by loyal soldiers of Gaddafi against protesters” - It looks like the guy on the left has nearly one half of a complete grenade?
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The caption from this photo read “citizens turn in captured ammunition to a local resistance militiaman” The 3 rds in his hand look like 12.7 and the belted stuff might be 23x115mm?
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More 23x115 or 23x152 ??
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Definitely a belt of 7.62x54r
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A protester holding up what he claims was a shell from aircraft that had fired on crowds 12.7?
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Here’s a non lethal 40mm or 37mm? casing from a rubber baton load fired on protesters in Bahrain:

Casings found by civilians:
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ammo & weapons depot captured by rebels:

A protester / rebel claiming an abandoned A-A missile (SA-2 ?). (lucky guy)
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Caption read: “munition lie in a state security building in Ben Ghazi captured by protesters”

The “boys” (in house term for the SAS) are in Libya. but my relations with the organisation is stretched now with time and the financial failure of the Artists Rifles (regimental assn) so I am no longer in the loop. all my contacts now are “badgees” ie retired

Great photos DK. Those “grenades” are actually automatic gun belt links. They appear to be from 23x152B anti-aircraft gun rounds.

That missile looks like it has been there for a while.

Thanks Falcon, links make more sense on second-look. I guess I should not be surprised that the press would identify them as grenades or grenade fragments though.

Here’s another good one, no idea what it is:

A tank shell:
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and more:
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The caption on this one read: “a protester holds a mortar shell that was use to destroy an ammunition store in Tobruk”

[quote=“mausernut”][quote=“Falcon”]I’m sure our Ex Prime Minister Tony Blair had something to do with the Sterling. He made alot of money for himself in corrupt dealings with Gaddafi.[/quote]He might equally have something to do with the Hi-Power wielded by one of the men in one of the pictures here:
http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2011/02/libya_unrest_and_uncertainty.html
Another of the pictures show men holding links, probably from the 14,5 mm fired at demonstrators just before. Theres even a pic of a guy holding an L1A1 though one missing its forearm. (Is it called that on an SLR?)
Soren[/quote]

My Bold

I’d say it was an FN FAL (and he has the hinge pin in the wrong way).

The L1A1 was called the SLR.

Matt, the 1st image (guy in black) is holding a recoilless 106mm HEAT.
That guy with the grey painted “tank shell” is holding a Polish 100mm for the D-10 tank gun or BS-3 field gun (and in emergency cases also for the KS-19 AA gun).
That guy with the belt is holding 23x152B ZU-23 cartridges for the gun in the background.
That “mortar shell” on the last image is a 57mm HE-T shell (w/o fuze) for the S-60 AA gun.

Those media people (as usual) are clueless.

[quote]The L1A1 was called the SLR.[/quote]Yes, I know, but is it (also) called a forearm? (As on a No4?)

Note that he has a british sling on the rifle, that the magazine probably is from a G1 doesn’t mean anything (metric magazine can be used in an inch version)
Last time I shot a G1 the handguard (forearm?) also fell off very quickly… Besides, that finger in the trigger guard makes me shiver… :-)
Soren

The shell described as the “mortar shell” also appears to be unfired. From the tarnished bands and dirt on it, it looks to have been on the ground for a good while before the protests started.

hello
for the picture of the guy holding a belt of 23x152 ammo ,the gun in back is a 14.5 ZPU 2 ,not a ZU 23 (the muzzlebrake is different

Il looks like a typical item which was scattered by an explosion (ammo dump, happens often in such situations as I have seen in the past) and has been smashed into the ground, hence the poor condition. No need to have stayed in the ground for long.

But I agree that some of the other ammo shown is not in the best condition and I wondered already why it looks so lousy. Again as I know from tin can republics ammo was often stored in bad conditions and looked similar bad. No compliment for an army…

[quote=“ammogun”]hello
for the picture of the guy holding a belt of 23x152 ammo ,the gun in back is a 14.5 ZPU 2 ,not a ZU 23 (the muzzlebrake is different[/quote]

I missed that, you are right, the 23mm flash hiders are cylindrical.

Every day there are just more & more press photos of rebels with munitions:

This guy has an AT3 “Sagger”
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Which is of the same sort found when this poor chap was busted in Kent, UK a few years ago: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1082974/Pictured-Incredible-weapons-haul-man-jailed-putting-750-grenades-Soviet-rocket-launcher-eBay.html

rebels linking up some 12.7:

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