The green one use the ordinary HS (LZ at 12)…recent production for Austria; the white one is pretty old production bearing HS (GR at 6 and caliber designation at 12)
Could you post a picture of the headstamps that go with those boxes. I have a “GR” 9 mm Headstamp, but the “GR” marking is at 12 o’clock and the caliber designation, “9mm LUGER” is at 6 o’clock.
That white box looks Italian to me, and the “GR” headstamp I have is definitely made by Fiocchi. I have four rounds where the headstamp font is identical:
GR 9mm LUGER
LE 9mm LUGER
CP 99 9 mm LUGER
PERFECTA 9mm LUGER
These are all known to be Italian, from Fiocchi.
It would be interesting to see the headstamp font on your “9 mm LUGER GR” cartridge.
Trabi - I will leave my above comments on the thread, although tempted to remove them.
I could not find anything on the “GR” headstamps, as to what the “GR” signifies, which annoys me, because I was sure I had information on that. I searched my Italian file for that information, but could find nothing.
My impression is that the GR headstamp was made for some Italian organization. If so, your box, which to me looked Italian, could very well be from ZVS. I don’t, for myself, need a picture of your “9mm LUGER GR” headstamp, as I found I had an empty case of that headstamp, as well as my Italian-made version “GR 9mm LUGER” among my 9 mm unknown headstamps. So, in short, thank you for identifying it.
Edited for the purpose of clarification and adding information I found in my collection.
as I see…there are minimum 3 different GR head stamped 9x19…but at least one can be identified for sure - the following:
100% it’s made by Limit Zlin, CZ many years ago (trying to find out the YOM and the customer for whom these cartridges were made). The white box is their product as well.
Sorry, I don’t have the loaded cartridge - I have got just the brand new box.
as a proof of this statement please find the picture of the spare bunter still lying in the shelf of the ammo plant. The No.1 has been worn and scrapped.
Tomas - thank you for the pictures. As I mentioned in my last response, thanks to you, I found in my “unknown” headstamps the very headstamp you described and pictured, and was able to place it where it belonged in my collection. I had forgotten I had it. So, this “GR” headstamp was made in two countries, Italy and the Czech Republic.
I am in the process of trying to find out what the “GR” means; that is, who this ammunition was made for.
There is a third variant headstamped 9 MM GR.
Picture by AveDanzig.
That’s a new one for me. I have no idea who made the cases, loaded it, etc.
Do any of our Italian friends know what “GR” stands for. I am asking them specifically because I was told when I got my first one, from a pretty reliable source, that it was for an Italian agency of some sort, but he didn’t know the name of it. Also, and it proved to be correct, that the “GR 9mm LUGER” headstamp (as opposed to “9 MM GR” and “9mm LUGER GR”) was made by Fiocchi.
Of course, I would also like to know who made the one that Fede posted for AveDanzig.
For what it’s worth, my notes state:
A “GR” hs is known on pistol ammunition referring to the trademark “GREIF” which was made by Fiocchi for: SK Jagd und Sportmunition GmbH Schönebeck.
Which likely came from our own website:
WBD - Certainly possible, although not what I heard. There is a “GREIF” headstamp on 9mm, fully spelled out, which I have in my own collection. Don’t recall who reportedly made that, and no time at the moment to go down and search it out in my collection. Will do that later.
That GREIF comes from this boxes, made in Hungary (at that time MFS)
The Italien GR which i have, cames from FIOCCHI and hs looked like this:
Also under use of the BRANDNAME GREIF, where ammunition made by SM from several used cases for DEURUS (the owne´r of the brandname GREIF at that time) They have various headstamps, and only the big box was marked with the Greif Trademark: (here a pic)
The Greif box is spectacular! Wish my round came with the box! I just came back from downstairs where I found my Greif-headstamped round, the same as yours, with my Hungarian group. Nice coincidence. Confirms what I thought it was.
Thank you Peter!