21 Gun Salute (4/17/18) LC 13 30-06 blanks


#1

My 92 y/o Father-in-law was laid to rest at Abraham Lincoln National Cemetery (Elwood, Illinois) (west of Chicago) on Tuesday 4/17/18 and was honored for his WWII service (Army Air Corp) with a 7 gun 3 round volley ("21 Gun Salute’)

It was a wonderful ceremony…but of special interest to me, the “cartridge wacko” was the fact that all of the spent blanks (left on the ground for the family to share)…(besides the three previously collected and presented with the folded flag to my 91 y/o Mother-in-law)…were all h/s’d…LC 13.

My reason to bring it up; is that I have been under the impression that 30-06 blanks were “drying up” and we have been encouraged to collect them and gift them to various VFW’s for just this purpose.

LC 13 surprised me that they were/are still in production and one must wonder if “just for this purpose”?

RIP “Ed”


#2

RIP. Sorry for your loss.


#3

92 y/o; wife alive; married just shy of 71 years, died with family at side (no pain; no tubes; no suffering)…just “ran out of gas”…we should all be so “lucky”

I stopped and saw him driving north from SLICS 18.

He wanted to know if I had fun and “got anything good” !


#4

EXTREME CONDOLENCES!

So grateful to the, “Greatest Generation,” and your Father In Law’s WW2 Service to our Country. Sending you all tons of non-stop positive vibes, energy and prayers.

Jason


#5

Pepper,

Information for the blanks used to honor your father-in-law with a 21 gun salute:

0.30 Cal. Blank M1909 LC (ATK) Fact Sheet.pdf (82.7 KB)

Brian


#6

my sincere condolences

I think I picked up a box of these at slics, however I just arrived at the german show and will have a look when I am back home


#7

It was chilly at the ceremony…but God did not test the -25 degree F limits of the round’s specs

(In spite of having rec’d 26.2" of April snow @ home in Green Bay last weekend)


#8

The military specification for the M1909 blank (document MIL-DTL-1312) was brought up to date in 2011 after it had been dormant for four decades (unchanged since 1967). The most recent revision G is from January 2018.

Like all small arms ammunition specifications, the newer revisions are controlled distribution documents.


#9

Frank Hackley has an excellent article on these blanks in the WSCCA Newsletter dated Feb 2017 (Volume 37 #1) on pg. 10.
Included are a box scan, the cartridge drawing & other very interesting information plus history / insight.


#10

my sincere condolences to you and the family,

I very recently found myself wondering about the same thing. I had a friend contact me last weekend. Seems he had a family member pass away recently. This person being a veteran also received the same honor of a 21 Gun Salute. My friend had picked up one of the fired blank casings after the service and wanted to know if I could some how mark it with the name of his relative and date of birth and date of passing. To which I of coarse agreed to do. When he gave me the casing on Monday I immediately looked at the headstamp. It read “L C 1 3” like the one Pepper has. Needless to say I was surprised by this. I had heard the same thing as Pepper about the supply of blanks drying up. I am very happy to see that Lake City had made a run of blanks so that our veterans can continue to at least receive this honor. I returned the engraved casing to my friend yesterday.
Zac


#11

As far back as 2007, one of the Army’s small arms ammunition guys at Picatinny Arsenal told me that there were plans to re-start .30 blank manufacture at Lake City as there were so many WWII and Korea veterans dying, and the funeral salutes were rapidly depleting the inventory of .30 blank ammunition.


#12

My father was a World War I Veteran. Ha passed away in February 1971 and is buried in the City Point National Cemetery in Hopewell, VA… At his military funeral after the 21 gun salute, and if my memory serves me correctly, all 21 empty casings were put into his casket flag and presented to my mother. Has it always been customary to only place three empty casings in the flag, or has this been changed since my fathers funeral? These blanks were not the crimped type. My son now has this flag along with a framed collage of his military metals, pocket New Testament, and a number of other related items. I still have his gas mask and helmet which will be prepped and given to my son at a later date.


#13

One experience makes me “one experience” but the 7 honor guardsmen fired three volleys (spent sells ejected on grass). Taps were played (somewhat distant to the pavilion) and the honor guard marched off. Then two young soldiers folded the casket flag and presented it to my mother-in-law. Then a seasoned veteran said a few words and presented her a small zip lock bag with three previously packaged spent shells telling her they “these represent the three volleys fired” that you might choose to place them with the flag. The ceremony was pretty much over and several of us picked up the freshly fired casings and gave one to each of the small family gathering. That said, I would see no way the fired shells would have been gathered and presented under the scenario I witnessed.

It was a fine 20-30 minute affair and then the one official remaining was anxious to move us along as there was another precession to soon follow us (and there were three pavilions but likely only one honor guard present).

That’s my experience


#14

Good to see .30 Blanks more readily available. However, U.S. Army will only issue to veterans groups that are using rifles issued by the Army and controlled under some silly rules. Outfits that do not use Army provided rifles and have their own cannot get the Army issued blanks. These are the groups which I provide free blank cartridges to. Thanks to many generous IAA members and others I still have a good supply on hand. Just ask.


#15

Thank you for collecting them. I bring to SLICS every year and will continue too


#16

At my Stepfather’s services in 2001 they put 3 fired casings representing the 3 volleys into the flag while folding it. I think they were from the rounds they had just fired but I could be mistaken and they may have had those prepared beforehand. This was before Lake City had resumed blank production so they were using Danish blanks (AMA 80 in this case).


#17

It seems as if our experiences vary. When my fathers flag is shaken one can hear the empty casings inside rattle against each other. Since this happened 47 years ago, I do not remember who picked up the empties and placed them inside of the flag while it was bring folded. The ceremony was not rushed at all, in fact it was quite the opposite.