25mm Chinese round


Just made an interesting discovery at Eurosatory, after obtaining a couple of catalogues from the Chinese stand.

For some time there have been photos of Chinese Army 25mm automatic cannon on the net, and this has sparked some debate as to which ammo they were using: the old Russian 25x218, the NATO 25x137 or the Oerlikon KBB 25x184. One photo of the ammo I thought was misidentified, in that it looked exactly like the 23x152B Russian, with a sloping shoulder and a belt.

However, one of the catalogues has an illustration of the Chinese 25mm ammo - and it looks just like a scaled-up 23mm! This is the first I’ve heard of a new Chinese cannon cartridge, and is the first new automatic cannon cartridge to enter service since - well, several decades. I need to measure up the drawing precisely when I get home before I can calculate the case length and other dimensions. Fascinating stuff!


You mean these:

I had the designation somwhere but can’t find it now. There is also an AP with a core.


It’s hard to be certain from that view. There’s a better pic on the China Defense Forum site here: china-defense.com/smf/index.php?topic=2562.0

The round designation is PG87 and it is available with two different HEI projectiles, an HEI-T, and API-T and an APDS-T. A quick and dirty measuring job gives a case length of around 182mm.


These actually are the 25mm since the guy who took the image confirmed it to me.


Is it just me or is that forum Tony linked to not up now? I was able to access it before and it indicated registration required. I went and registered to be able to access the site and now I can’t get the thing to load up. Google does not seem to want to let me at it. Any ideas?

Or…perhaps someone could post the image of the new Chinese 25mm in a nice side view perspective?




I’ve sent you a pm about the 25mm.

The China Defense forum works OK for me.


Tony was kind enough to provide me with excellent information and here is a rendering of the HEI-T round and a dimensional drawing generated as best as possible with the info at hand. The projectile section is representative but the case interior dimensions are pure speculation…


Edited for clarity.


The best so far Dave. Unbelievable!


Brilliant drawing Dave.


Now all we need is someone to manufacture some dummies…


So many of these things would be easy if one had access to a CNC lathe and the knowledge to program it.


Thanks for the data.