.30-03 question


#1

I went though several 50c bins at Allentown Forks of Delaware show and found multiple .30-03’s. The dummy one I never saw before. And is it wood or paper projectile in the one on the right? How rare is the one in the middle? The paper label on the right one says “P.A.Meyer & Sons 1.00” Who was this company?



#2

The F A 3(?) 05 is a paper bulleted blank, the tinned dummy is uncommon & this type, I assume it has three holes?, is worth in the $150 & up range. Other types have a cannelure at the base of the neck & we sold one of those in our sale 11 lot 279 for $230.00.

Look in Hackley for the various types.

No Idea who P.A. Meyer & Sons is, but could be a gun shop, hardware store or general goods retail outlet.


#3

Thanks,Pete. Actually it has 4 holes.


#4

Look carefully at the neck of the blank on the right.

I believe the blank is one of the .30 model of 1903 blanks which was later arsenal converted for use in the Model 1903 rifles after adoption of the .30-06 cartridge. Note that it has the long neck of the .30-03, but the front has been necked down slightly to work in the .30-06 chamber where the neck of the case (and overall case length) is .10" shorter.
Below is a scan from HWS volume 1 page 155 showing a box for these"

image


#5

Woe is me … !!

Years ago, when it was still possible to trade inert cartridges on eBay I bought a lot of 5 clips of these dummies. I bought them for the special clips, similar to the regular one but without the little tabs on the end so they could be re-used many times. All of the dummies but two had split necks … I kept the two good ones, but I’ve not a clue what happened to the others.

Here’s one of the clips;

gulp … sob

Peter


#6

Looks like a Mauser clip judging by the square ends. US M1903 clip had round ends to clear ejector out of the way.


#7

To everybody on this posting for once I am truly interested what are the earliest recorded stamps for
the MOD 19-03 I have a round that says F A 03 12 and a paper bulleted blank in a tin washed case
that says FA 10 05 and 2 dummies like the middle one shown above they are similar but I am wondering
the one has the 4 holes but a little further up the case with the stamp F A 18 and a spitzer bullet the
next one is the same without holes but a strange stamp it only says FA 4 spitzer bullet but empty primer
pocket I have others with 03 stamps from WRA.Co and UMC.Co but feel they are not early enough to
bring up here.
Sherryl


#8

As Springfield found to their cost when Mauser sued them for breach of several of their Patents … and won.

I’m not familiar with the mechanics of the M’03 rifle, they’re not common here in the UK, but the very early clips, for both dummy and live ammunition, have squared ends … although they were soon replaced with rounded ones.

According to Brophy, p324;

“The first government illustration of the clip for the '03 is in the 1904 Rules For The Management” , “Clips can be recharged a number of times, the tongue being reset each time and the clip for dummy cartridges has square instead of rounded ends and the tongues on the spring are omitted”. (Pittman notes also illustrates this square-ended dummy cartridge clip.)"

The 1904 Rules are available as a facsimile, does anyone have the relevant pages that they could show here ?

1904

Peter


#9

Sherryl
The Cal. .30 Model 1906 superseded the M-1903, so how do you have one dated 1912? Please check the case length.
Again a dummy stamp F A 18 ??
Then one stamped FA 4 which is 1945?

Your 10 05 date sounds like an 03 & it should have a round nose bullet

The earliest M1903 was made from brass with the rim thickness cut down from the M-1901 But with the same case length. So any of the .30-01 dates can appear as a .30-03. Specifically I don’t know the first date.
My earliest .30-01 headstamp is “F 12 01” (3 position headstamp read 12, 8 & 5)

USCCo, WRACo & UMC all made .30-03


#10

Pete A little miss understanding The date is FA Dez 1903 I should have turned the numbers around
anyway you told me what I wanted to know. That one round with the FA 4 should really be 1943
I found out they manipulated the bunters.And yes that FA 18 is really a blank even it has 4 holes in the
case but there is a primer. And no that FA 10 05 has a paper bullet and a tinned case.
Sherryl


#11

Hi Peter,

Here is the illustration and description of the clips found in the 1904 and 1906 editions of “Rules for the Management”:

And a picture of the dummy cartridge clip from Pitman’s notes:

126

Regards,

Fede