30-06 grenade blanks


#1

Unmarked box of grenade blanks reportedly from Venezuela. These are not noise blanks. Quite a variety of headstamps. Does anyone know more ?


#2

Grenade Cartridges, not blanks.


#3

Firstly, given the Mixture of head stamps ( IM and FN) the Packet could be a repack, or even reloaded Ball cases.
IM- Industrias Militares, Dominican Republic, and FN is FN.
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The Silvery primers make me suspect a reload, as FN used brass primers in all its .30 cal. ( RWS makes nickled .217/5,5mm primers).

The Packet may be Dominican rather than Venezuelan.

Regards,
Doc AV
AV ballistics.


#4

In the absence of a box label and seemingly of any information about these cartridges, how do we know they are Grenade Cartridges and not Blank Cartridges? Not all rosebud-crimped .30-06 cartridges are Grenade rounds. I think the current “M9” blanks being made in Brazil for the US (I assume for ceremonial purposes only) are rosebud-crimped, or am I wrong? Just wondered. I am not disputing the identification as I don’t know at all what they are or from where. I just wndered what made it such a positive ID.


#5

The primer crimps and sealant remind me of some Columbian .30-06 ball ammunition I recently had. This was remanufactured from once fired US military brass. In the picture it appears as if some cartridges have brass colored promers and some have silver colored ones. Is this true? Also appears that some lack the primer crimp?

AKMS


#6

These came from a fellow who had a case of them and had shot up the rest firing rifle grenades. If you put a noise blank in a gun and add a rifle grenade after pulling the trigger you will be looking for parts of your face and hands.
He bought the case at the MG shoot down South where they were all having a great time firing rifle grenades. I passed on the rifle grenade to go with these.
He was down to his last so sold me the box of shells.

You might remember the problems which come up from time to time with reloaders breaking down blank cartridges and using them to make ball ammo. This is never a good idea as you know.


#7

I looked through Chris Punnetts’ book last night. Your blank cartridges fit the description he gives of blanks manufactured by “Industria Militar” in Columbia using fired cases of mixed origins, including having both brass colored and silver colored primers and the headstamps shown. No mention is made of packaging or if these are noise or grenade launching cartridges, they are just listed in the “Blanks” section. The box you show is not at all like the type used for their re-manufactured ball cartridges. I am curious why cartridges for rifle grenade launching are in a box with NO markings at all. Seems like such a specific use would warrant having proper identification. I suspect that the box is not original to the cartridges.

The fact that Columbian headstamped brass is present in the box strongly suggests to me that these are Columbian in origin.

AKMS


#8

Countries and manufacturers do things for their own reasons which are sometimes not logical to us. One can find most types of military ammo in unmarked boxes from time to time. Why? You will have to tell me. I have had everything from German 7.9 PMK to 11 Mauser , 30-06 , 9mm etc in plain boxes. My question to Chris would be " how do you know these blanks as described by you were not grenade blanks" - assuming these are the same ones which he reported. I take the word of end users when it come to such things. If you want enlightening grab a noise blank for your AK and slap a rifle greande on the barrel. Report back; if you can. You can count on me to send flowers even though I told you so. This is not ADVICE . It is a WARNING ! Experimental at your own risk!


#9

Would the danger be from faster burning powder in the blanks? I’ve never heard of the danger in using noise blanks to propel rifle grenades, but I’ve never had any real interest in either blanks or rifle grenades. What I have seen suggests that one simply gets shorter range with the noise blank vs. a proper grenade cartridge…

I have seen warnings to not use rifle grenade cartridges in place of noise blanks with a blank firing attachment in place due to the risk of damaging the weapon. This suggests to me that the rifle grenade cartridge is more powerful than a noise blank, or is it more of a volume of gas vs. it’s velocity?

1DD


#10

There is a big difference between the cartridges of today and those from WWII and prior years. Noise blanks are loaded with a different powder than the old detonating powders and some can be used as grenade cartridges. The current crop of Lake City Cal .30 M1909 Blanks even have the rosette crimp.

It pays to know exactly what you have and how they were intended to be fired. Otherwise, you really do risk serious damage to your rifle and likely your fingers and eyes as well.


#11

It is called BRISANCE . That is the rate at which an explosion occurs. If a propelling charge is burning or exploding is an unsettled question BUT the rate at which the charge is converted into energy is considered brisance in any event. Blank powder burns very rapidly compared to propelling powders and produces immediate high pressure as a result. Since there is little or no obstruction involved the pressure drops instantly. Put a cap on it and the energy is likely to blow the gun apart. The rifle grenade acts as a major obstruction and produces extreme pressures for which guns are usually not proofed. Grenade blanks are purpose designed to produce a more gradual pressure. These are microseconds in consideration. The change from black powder to semismokeless to smokeless and to whatever is in the fill today is very much concerned with pressure. If you load a 7.62x39 ball round with black powder and fire it with a standard bullet you are taking you life in your hands.


#12

Thank you for the explanation.

AKMS