30-40 Krag?


#1

The cartridge on the Left is a standard Gallery round, the one on the right is the one I have questions about. It doesn’t appear to be a reload it has a flat brown copper primer all the dim. are correct for a Krag with the exception of the shoulder angle and both rounds weight the same. There is a groove in the lead bullet at the case mouth. Any ideas??


#2

One is a Gallery and one is a Sub-Caliber ???

SWAG

Ray


#3

CAROLYN:
KNOWING THE HEADSTAMP OF THE CARTRIDGE IN QUESTION COULD POSSIBLY HELP! FRANKFORD ARSENAL PRIMERS WERE ROUNDED COPPER NOT FLAT.

RAY:
YOU ARE HALF RIGHT!


#4

The headstamp is F 1 02


#5

[quote=“GWB”] . . .RAY:
YOU ARE HALF RIGHT![/quote]

That’s the story of my life. ;-)


#6

CAROLYN:
DR. WALTER G. HUDSON WAS A MEMBER 0F THE 1902 UNITED STATES RIFLE TEAM. HE WAS ALSO AN EXPERIMENTER WITH THE KRAG CARTRIDGE, ATTEMPTING TO DEVELOP A REDUCED LOADING USING A LEAD BULLET WITH A REDUCED POWDER CHARGE. THE RIFLE TEAM NEEDED A CARTRIDGE OF THIS TYPE TO USE IN PRACTICE SHOOTING ON INDOOR OR LIMITED LENGTH OUTDOOR RANGES. DR. HUDSON WAS WELL CONNECTED AND HAD FRIENDS WITH; LAFLIN & RAND POWDER CO., UNION METALLIC CARTRIDGE CO. AND IDEAL MANUFACTURING CO. THESE COMPANIES ASSISTED HIM IN HIS QUEST. BY FAR THE MOST IMPORTANT OF THESE WAS THE IDEAL MANUFACTURING CO., OWNED BY HIS FRIEND JOHN BARLOW, WHICH MADE BULLET MOLDS TO HUDSON’S AND OTHERS SPECIFICATIONS. MOST OF HUDSON’S EXPERIMENTS WERE CONDUCTED STARTING IN LATE 1901 AND CONTINUED UNTIL EARLY 1903.HUDSON CONDUCTED MOST OF HIS EXPERIMENTS USING 4 OR 5 DIFFERENT BULLET DESIGNS. THE ROUND YOU ARE ASKING ABOUT IS VERY POSSIBLY ONE OF HIS LOADINGS. THE FLAT COPPER PRIMER WOULD BE CORRECT AS U.M.C. FURNISHED HUDSON WITH PRIMERS AS THEIR PART OF THE CO-OPERATIVE AGREEMENT. I AM UNABLE TO TELL POSITIVELY IF THE BULLET IS ONE THAT HUDSON WAS KNOWN TO HAVE USED BUT THE PROFILE SUGGESTS THAT IT COULD BE.
NOTES: HUDSON USED MORE THAN 4 OR 5 BULLET DESIGNS BUT NOT ALL OF THESE WERE WELL DOCUMENTED. SOME OF THE BULLETS USED GAS CHECKS. HUDSON ALSO DESIGNED CALIBER .30 BULLETS WITH FULL METAL JACKETS, THESE WERE MANUFACTUED BY BOTH W.R.A.CO. AND U.M.C. THE DR. TITLE IS BECAUSE HE WAS A DENTIST. HE WON THE PALMA TROPHY IN THE 1902 MATCHES.


#7

It may also be a “State Militia” reload, as the Gov’t, in those days, was not inclined to provide service ammunition to the militias for practice.

Randy


#8

George & Randy
Any ideas about the the why of the difference in shoulder placement and angle on the one on the right when compared to the left example?


#9

Pete: The shoulder might look like that because it’s a fired case that’s been neck sized. Being a reload would also account for the non-FA primer. Jack


#10

GWB - Dr Hudson was not a dentist. He was a medical doctor specializing in industrial medicine. And he did not have friends at Laflin and Rand, he worked there. He listed his own occupation there as “dynamite expert”.