.303 Sec Plastic M63


#1

From a thread search, I found that these cartridges are for training / short-range practice. Is “Sec” an abbreviation of “Sectionée”, as with the French short-range Balle Sectionée made for the 8x50mm Lebel?


#2


Think these are the boxes your referring too?
I’m sorry but I can’t answer your question about the abbreviation.

FYI These are headstamped F N 62 are .303 Inch and have a white, somewhat translucent, plastic round nose bullet. The box on the right has the same lot and ASM number as the left one but the back has a black rubber stamp indicating police use.


#3

I’m also not able to help with the “SEC” meaning, but I do have some questions…
M 63 = .303 British
M 64 = .30-06
M 67 = 7.62 NATO (?)

Any other calibers in this series?

Also, any idea what headstamp(s) one could expect on " .30 SEC PLASTIC M 64 Lot 1, ASM 67" box?

Thanks, Dave


#4

Sorry to disturb you… “SEC” is absolutely not for “sectionnée”, but for “SECURITE”, as they were ammunition made for riot control. The “Gendarmerie” rubber stamp on the box is rather uncommon, but confirms this explanation.
Similar SEC belgian cartridges are also known in .30-06 calibre, with translucent uncolored or opaque red plastic bullets.

Philippe


#5

I’m told that ASM is the company in Belgium that loaded these cartridges. I am traveling now and do not have access to my records to tell you who ASM was. I do remember that I had never heard of the company when it was identified for me.

Cheers, Lew


#6

Regarding the M 64 designation, I’ve not seen this same bullet in either 06 or 7.62 NATO, but do have a similar round nose white (not at all translucent but a solid color) plastic bullet showing three smooth grooves. It is in a " L C 5 6 " .30-06 case, and is a fake as per Mr. Woodin.
Now please let me say I’m not disputing the M 64 (or other) designations, but just want others to be aware of a fake (made to trade for money & wrong)


#7

This is the sealed box I have. Don’t think I have a loose example and was looking to confirm the contents. It’s .30-06 from what I remember, just can’t recall what they look like if I did see a loose one at all. Arsenal de Munitions, Belgium per Chris P from the Forum’s previous incarnation.

Dave


7,62x51 belgian Sec Plastic M67
#8

Thanks for the responses, gentlemen.

Stuka222: Do you happen to know what the muzzle velocity was for the .303 rounds? The cartridge I broke down had 15.8 grains of a grey (aren’t they all) flake powder, and the 0.791" long bullet had a crimping groove (cannelure), weighed 12.1 grains and measured 0.315" in diameter in front of the case mouth and 0.313" on the shank. It seems like the bullet would be moving much too fast for riot control work, even using ricochet fire. In a test, four five-shot groups averaged 2 inches at 50 yards from No. 1 MkIII* with 600 yards on the rear sight putting the bullets 3 inches above the point of aim at the same range.

I sent an email to FN about these cartridges before I found out they were assembled by another company using FN components. I’ll post any response I receive.

Thanks again.


#9

I am certain that my .30-06 with “Balle SEC” made of translucent plastic, hstped FN 65 is legitimaten as the neck is crimped the same way that the .303 british ones. When shaking the specimen, it is easy to note that the load is minored when compared to a normal Ball round.

The red plastic bulleted specimen is a reduced range training round, which was delivered in 3 parts :
-the case, any kind of hstp or origin, as surplus or once-fired brass, but of course Boxer primed,
-1 or 3 boxer primers, with brass cups,
-a load made of a square of nitrated paper (2 or 3 pieces of paper).

The plastic bullet is hemispherical at both ends. I obtained it in Belgium years ago-I think around 1968…-It was very common amidst collectors, who grabbed them on military and police training ranges.

For the Vo, I am unhappily unable to say anything…

Philippe.


#10

I have a box of the .30 M64 rounds labeled identically to the one shown by DaveE except it is “Lot 1 ASM 69”. The headstamp is F N 62. The rounds have a short, round-nose opaque plastic bullet. Oval brass primer w/purple annulus.


#11

BerdanIII,

It does sound like some high muzzle velocity there to get groups at 50 yds. with a 12 gr. plastic bullet. Probably would “leave a mark” if used in the riot control mode! Didn’t mean to hi-jack your post but I was excited to see the topic come up. Had that box for years and have yet to run into another for content ID.

Philippe,

Am I following right that you indicate the white plastic version is for riot control use and there is a red plastic version for SR target use? Were the red ones made by the same ASM?

Phil,

Thanks for confirming the contents of your box. The on again/off again temptation to unseal mine has subsided!

Dave


#12

Here’s a picture of all three calibres for comparison.
.303 ( F N 52 ) 7.62x51mm ( F N 68 ) .30-06 ( F N 62 )

Jim


#13

As I write early’r on the forum, ASM (AS MUN, Ammo arsenal) is not a company It’ a part of division logistiek of the Belgian army. They a placed close to Antwerp.


#14

[quote=“Jim”]Here’s a picture of all three calibres for comparison.
.303 ( F N 52 ) 7.62x51mm ( F N 68 ) .30-06 ( F N 62 )

Jim[/quote]

The .303 and the .30 look similar to the short range training cartridge with nylon bullet loaded at Palencia, Spain in 1967 (first in my photo). It has a 0,60 g bullet and a muzzle velocity of 850 m/s.


#15

Ammo can label for the .30 Cal. (.30-06) SEC blanks and box from the same ammo can.

30-06)%20SEC%20Blank