32 winchester special varities


Hello again. I have been watching the auction sites for the last 3 years, looking for odd loadings for the 32 Winchester Special. I have never seen any loadings other than the 170 grain soft points. I have heard there was once a 110 grain loading and maybe 165 grain hp loading. I am unsure of these. The one loading I would be very interested in would be FMJ loading. Does anyone know if a FMJ bullet was ever loaded and what other weights and types were available? Thank again in advance.


A quick once-over of the John Witzel .32 Win Spl cartridge collection catalog, which lists over 200 variations, revealed that bullet weights for this caliber were 125 grain, 150 grain, 165 grain and 170 grain. I didn’t see any 110 grain specimens, but it is not impossible that I might have missed it. Bullet types are legion, and I could not possibly list them all here.

There was one 180 grain listing, but it was on a dummy round, I forget which maker, and it may have been a typo error, and supposed to read “170 grains.” I simply don’t know. I only saw one such entry.

It seems like every major manufacturer offered, at one time or another, FMJ bullets, usually 170 grain. I noted Kynoch, Peters, Remington, Union Metallic Cartridge Co, United States Cartridge Co, and Winchester Repeating Arms company. There may have been others. I simply didn’t have time this evening to read the entire catalog thoroughly.

Frankly, there are twice the cartridge specimens known in this caliber, judging by Witzel’s work, than I had thought there would be. It is clear that one could have an impressive collection of nothing other than calibers for which the Model 1894 Winchester was chambered - 25-35, 32-40, 32 Win Spl, .30-30, and .38-55 Winchester (and a couple of modern ones as well like 307 Winchester, etc.).

edited for spelling and grammar only.


The first “SUPER SPEED” offering by Winchester, in the green box of about 1925, was loaded with a 110 grain bullet, and I seem to remember that the Remington Blue and Green “Train” boxes contained cartridges loaded with 165 grain bullet…



Randy - great that you could confirm the 110 grain bullet. Lots of 165 grain loadings were made.


JOHN MOSS, you and others have mentioned the book by John Witzel on occasion and I have heard he was a top collector but I am unaware of his book-books. Could you give me the titles of his book so I can try to locate one for my collection.


Remchester - I don’t know of any book by Witzel. What I have is a list of his .25-35, .30-30 and 32 WS collection, including pictures of all the cartridges. I took it off a website several years ago. It took me the better part of a day to print it out, filling four regular binders. It was on Geroge Hoyems website. Have no idea if it is still there or not.


Can anyone help a computer handicapped person find a site that has John Witzels research. It sounds like he had the same intrests in cartridges as I do. I have heard he was a very knowledgeable man and would like to learn more of his research.


George Hoyem, who publishes cartridge books under the “Armory Publications” label has done an incredible amount to support the hobby over the years. His books are solid reference works, and I encourage everyone to buy one of each (more if you like!) to help encourage and subsidize his decades long efforts. (Heck, I’m not even a real “cartridge collectors” and I have just about all of his books!)

Part of his service to collectors was to post the John Witzel stuff on his website:

Go, check that out, and the rest of his stuff.

Then, don’t be a cheapskate freeloader, spend a bit buying George Hoyem’s books and maybe he will put out more stuff you like.

At least, send him an email thanking him for all he has done!


Looks like, that except for a couple in 165 grain, most everything else shown is .32 WS is 170 grain. Great information.


Thanks John S, that site is exactly what I was looking for. I have tried to email the site you suggested but am having troubles connecting. I will give him a call Monday to see if he has a book for sale with the Witzel collection.


In Giles & Schuey’s book, they indicate that Winchester changed their .32 WS loadings from the 165 grain bullet to the 170 grain bullet in 1904. They show no other bullet weights as having been loaded by Winchester.


Here is the first Super Speed .32 Winchester Special box…I believe it says these are loaded with a 110 grain bullet ?