I recently got a sealed wood box of Cartridges, S.A. (small arms) Ball, B.L.S.B. (breech loading smooth bore) MKIz (z=nitrocellulose, not cordite) at a Jacksonville, FL gun show. The seller claims that there is an unopened tin of 10-round packets of these cartridges inside. He included one extra packet, which is where I got the label, headstamp, etc. A stencil on the box indicates that it contains 180 cartridges, or 18 ten-round packets. I plan to haul the box to SLICS and break the seal there, with anyone interested looking on to see what’s actually inside. I expect 18 mint packets of 10 rounds, but who knows. I’ll pass the packets out to anyone who wants one at a nominal cost to cover the cost of the full wood box.
Pakistani or Indian?
“POF” in the headstamp = Pakistan Ordnance Factories, Wah Cantt, Pakistan
The Box itself, is an uncommon and interesting item. It is British in origin, and is called a “Half Box” or Half Case,
Being half the size of the old standard Wooden Chest used for SAA (Rifle/MG ammo…
The “Half Box” was usually used for “Pistol” (ie, Revolver) ammunition, firstly .455, them .38 and 9mm; it was also used for “Special Loads” of other cartridges, where a Full Box would have been Wasteful.
AS mentioned in an earlier Post, the “Z” (Nitrocellulose Propellant) is thought to be an analogue of OLIN WW452 ( as a Bulk Powder for Factory Loading.
They are the most adorable little boxes.
Bonjour Mel, I am interested for the Empty Wood box…
Those unopened crates and 10 round packs have been popping up a lot in the last few months. I was unaware of them until offered 10 packs and the opened metal box from inside a wood crate two months ago. An internet search will turn up a number of hits, all POF and most dated 1960. Unopened crates are still listed at one online wholesaler that I’m aware of. I believe you will be pleased when you open the crate Mel, as my packs and the cartridges in them are pristine.
There is an old thread about these.
It even notes the lot numbers found within some of the crates.
To restart it, I have a “29 6 60” and a “22 6 60” and here Mel shows a “9 9 60”.
With respect to the Box, the British didn’t have such a thing as ‘Standard box’ in fact in 1943 we had over 20 different size ‘Box, A.S.A’ in use (considerably more if you include different Marks of boxes).
Guy is right. When I googled “.410 Ball Ammunition,” there were two ammunition dealers on the list who offer this identical full, sealed wood box of 180 rounds for $50, or about 28 cents a round. One, LuckyGunner.com has four buyer reviews of the ammunition and all rave about how good it is; bright, new, noncorrosive, surefire, etc. One reviewer even commented on how good it smells. (If you like old surplus military ammunition, you will understand this comment.) FedEx or UPS ground shipping from East Tennessee to me in Northeast Florida was $16. If I buy two boxes, shipping goes up about three dollars. This site shows multiple pictures of the sealed black tin inside the wood crate. The site also describes the converted .303s done to allow Indians (and apparently Pakistanis) to have a police weapon, but not a standard .303 army rifle. Some surplus smoothbore conversions were further converted by opening up their chambers to fit a standard .410 shotshell, and you don’t want to shoot one of these ball rounds in those.
The other dealer is SouthernOhioGun.com, and his price is the same. Interestingly, yet another dealer is offering the same ammunition for $5.50 a round, or $45 for a sealed packet of 10.
I thought I was getting a real good deal on the full wood box I bought at the Jacksonville gun show, but it turns out I actually over-paid by $10 if I include the $16 shipping I would have had to pay. However, I’m still going to do what I said and break the seals on my box at SLICS and pass out the contents, hopefully mainly to foreign collectors at the show since U.S. collectors can get all they want so cheaply now. I was thinking about putting the wood “half-box,” (thanks, Doc AV)one unopened 10-round packet, and one extra round in the Friday night auction, but the auction has a $50 lot minimum value and I figure that stuff has a value of about $7.88, assuming the box is worth $5.
My case is lot 10,5,60. Inside the top cover is a label with the packer’s number and who the soldered the liner. They are so cute I have started to buy another case a number of times, but everyone, or most have one already so it is of little use. But it is cute!!!
They were around last year. I think one of the British collectors brought some of the packets and a crate back from SLICS 2016
One dealers supply in 2014:
Yes, Daniel Tobin. He imported it. He still has loads of it and now questions if he should have imported it. “Sometimes even if something is dirt cheap, it does not mean you should buy it” he once told me.
The loose 10 round packs from my first purchase are lot 11 10 60. The crate I bought later (yep, I couldn’t resist), which I’m not planning to open it until I have disposed of the cartridges from the first purchase, has P.O.F. 11.10.60 on the wood crate, so I assume this indicates the lot number on the 10 round packs inside will match the loose packs I bought earlier.