.440 Nagant or .44 Nagant?


#1

L&G

I have the following quetion and I would appreciate your help.

I have a cartridge headstamped .440 Nagant Eley and the dimentions match with the following drawing but not with the headstamp.

Drawing find in the form:

In fact, the headstamp match with the following drawing but not with the lengths of the cartridge:

These are the pictures of the cartridge that trigger this question:

And the headstamp:


Thank you


#2

Daniel, I don’t know why this headstamp was used for the .44 Brazilian Nagant because as you said this is the headstamp corresponding to the .440 Argentine Nagant (which is also found in this caliber). Maybe this was caused because of the confusing designations used by Eley in the early years. For example, the 1907-8 catalog lists the Argentine cartridge for the first time as “.44 Nagent” (it also exist with ELEY .440 NAGENT headstamp), then the 1908-9 edition corrects its designation to “.44 Nagant”, and in 1910-11 its name is changed to “.440 Nagant (Argentine Model)” and the Brazilian cartridge is included under the designation “.44 Nagant (Brazilian Model)”. Both are the names used until they were last offered by Nobel in 1925.

For some reason, when FNCM (post-1929) and CBC (post-1936) made this cartridge they choose the “.440 Nagant” designation.


#3

Thank you Fede

There is anyone in the forum that could attach a picture of the .440 ?

Saludos desde Uruguay


#4

The British were inclined to add a superfluous zero to the ends of calibres. .450, .380, .320, .300 (for the .30-06) etc and the humble .22RF can be found described sometimes as .220. A lot of .22RF BSA Martini rifles are stamped that way. Think of it as a national quirk.

If you look hard enough you will probably find the .44-40 described somewhere as a .440 Win in some catalogue or other.


#5



#6

A antidote about a ammunition site that was selling unstamped 44 Nagants and found out later they were the much rarer 44 Henry Center fire made for a SA country. A few guys got one heck of a bargain and still may not know it. Vic


#7

IIRC the .44 Nagant was about identical to the .44 Henry (centerfire) and the Winchester 66 reformed to centerfire was extensively used by Brazil army.
Martin


#8

The one on the right has a label. “ELEY”



#9

Pete, nice Eley variations. The one on the right looks like an early .442 Long made by Eley. Can you post its dimensions? Thanks, Fede.


#10

Hi Fede
I think it’s too short to be a 442 Long, as it’s much shorter than my others. But that said…

rim .495" / 12.57mm
head .444 / 11.27
mouth .444 / 11.27
bullet .447 / 11.35
CL .933 / 23.71
oal 1.455 / 36.96

Think I put it with these because rim, head & OAL pretty much fit.

Be nice to know exactly what it is.