5.56 help to ID please

I have two 5.56 rounds which I can not id 100% First is from Radway Green UK To me this case has two black bands on the case, I dont know what they stand for, and can not find a reference for them.

As for the second round, I think this was made by Remington at the Lonoke Plant, and the bullet was called “Power Lokt”. question 1= is it a solely commercial round? Q2= what does the single dot at 9 0’clock indicate. Photo 4 showes the bullet tip looking head on, the grey looking bullet jacket is flash bounce back(sorry!)

thanks......paul.

Paul, no idea on the black case marks and not something I have seen before but I am not convinced that they are intentional…but perhaps they are. However, there is definitely something strange about the head of that case; the outer circumference appears unusually rough to the extent that its actually distorted the headstamp - the edge would normally have a nice clean chamfer to it. 1982 was an important year for UK production of 5.56mm as this was the first year of the ‘new’ SS109 bullet so I am thinking this round is some sort of factory test run. The actual designation of this round with this particular headstamp was the XL2E1.
My only thought on your Remington round is that, to my eye, there is a second matching dot on the opposite side of the head. Its very faint but I think its there.

[quote=“timeout”]
As for the second round, I think this was made by Remington at the Lonoke Plant, and the bullet was called “Power Lokt”. question 1= is it a solely commercial round? Q2= what does the single dot at 9 0’clock indicate. [/quote]

Paul,

Beside being listed in civilian market Remington catalogs, the 1976 Remington Law Enforcement Products catalog lists the .223 Rem H.P.P.L. 55gr.

Ron Fuchs lists ‘’ R - P 223 REM " headstamped cases with the single dot in the headstamp at 9 O’clock and with 2 dots, one at 9 O’clock and one at 3 O’clock. No information is given pertaining to the dots.

Brian

May not be relevant, but did Remington ever use or trial G & W machinery.?

Footscray manufactured early 5.56mm on G & W machinery, the earliest case I have noted is MF 87 with the dots, in an inert loading. I believe this is the first year with headstamp.

The reason I mention this, is there must have been some interaction between Footscray and Remington. In 1974 I was sent a complete drawset of case and bullet from Footscray. I was hoping for MF headstamps but was surprised to see the case draws were marked R-P 5.56mm and the completed dummy round headstamped R P 6 8. The bullet is a FMJ GM Boattailed.

Silly question: Who is G & W ?

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=16445 :

[quote=“DocAV”]… 7,62 and 5,56 made on SCAMP machinery back in the mid-80s, here in Australia, when they were trialing the Gulf+Western SCAMP system.

Doc AV[/quote]

Side note: Remington was the contractor in charge of running Lake City Army Ammunition Plant during the time SCAMP (an acronym for “Small Caliber Ammunition Modernization Program”) machinery was installed there back in the 1970’s - 1980’s.

Thank you.

MF.87… was not the first year of SCAMP Production in Australia…I have some “Draw sets” (unfinished cases, untrimmed, cylindrical, with rim, etc ) as early as 85; but MF.86… did go out to Troop trials (have spent range Brass of 1986).

MF went back to Berdan (7,62) in 1989-90-91; as the SCAMP machinery was returned in 1989 ( There is no Boxer “AFF…89…”, only BERDAN AFF89 and AFF90; Old Machinery(?) was used for Boxer AFF 91 in both calibres. New Facility at Benalla (Vic) started Production in 1995, (5,56 only) with New European-made Machinery.

During the Years 1985 and 2000, MF bought in a lot of FN, IMI, PSD, and RG ammunition to make up for MF/AFF/ADI production shortfalls.

Doc AV

DocAV
Thank you for the additional information on the 85, 86 production. Do any of the 85 drawset cases have a headstamp? I also would appreciate a photo of the 1986 headstamp, please.

My notes show that 300,000 ADI 95 F1 were produced, only for test and destruction. Actual deliveries commenced in April 1996.

John

They seemed to have made more than just 300,000 of ADI 95 F1 (5,56), as I have found them constantly in scrap (range produce) Brass I acquired back in the early 2000s… small in quantity considering the Larger Proportion of ADI 96, 98…97 is also scarce. All my shells came from Nth. Qld ( Townsville, Lavarack Bks.). I Recycle commercially ( refurb the cases to Original specs, for resale, and use them in house for Movie Blanks in several calibres) so I see qtys of one or two tons at a time.

My sorting table for 5,56 cases has trays for cases from 86 thru to 2005, ( MF/AFF/ADI) as well as TZZ, FNB, RG, RTA, LC, PSD, CIS, etc.

Doc AV

Thanks for that. Probably continued manufacture after testing in 95, even though delivery was in the next year. Not unusual.

JP, I would guess that G&W is Gulf & Western, possibly makers of the machinery.

Thanks. Bdgreen already confirmed your guess.