.577/.450 id

I recently picked up a .577/.450 with drawn case, normal lead white paper patched bullet and brass primer. headstamp is “G G L” in a 3 x 120 format.

Does the “G” signify Gardner? Could “L” be Lorenz or Ludlow?
Any thoughts?


In my sale 8, lot 548 I advanced the following theroy about your Gardner Gun Ludlow cartridge:

In 1869 an E. & A. Ludlow & Co. engineer named Jones developed the first solid drawn brass cartridge case in England, and this drawn brass .577 /450 M-H with it

The Ludlow theory for ‘G G L’ hst can’t be correct. E & A Ludlow went out of business in 1871 and the Gardner gun wasn’t invented until 1874.
I doubt E & A Ludlow had an opportunity to manufacture the .577/450 in any form since even the coiled case wasn’t adopted until 1871.
I don’t believe ‘G G L’ stands for Gatling Gun Limited - my best guess is the ‘L’ is for Lorenze who bought out Latimer,Clark & Muirhead who definately made the solid case .577/450 and machinery was therefore available to the Lorenze Arms & Ammunition Company - but it’s just a best guess!

Also - there was no ‘Ludlow & Co’ - only ‘E & A Ludlow’ - and their factory was not in Wolverhampton - it was in Legge Street, Birmingham.

Until John pointed it out, I had not thought of the dates of the demise of Ludlow and the likely date of the cartridge. I do not think the “G” stands for “Gatling” either.
I suspect it does stand for “Gardner” though and Lorenz is the most likely manufacturer.