7.2x59 DWM 431H for Sweden

I just stumbled across the 7.2x59 DWM 431H made for Sweden (by DWM of course).

Is anybody able to shed any info on the whole story, weapons and when it happened and the probable context to other experimental calibers made in relation to Sweden?

Here the entry from the DWM case catalog:
7.2x59_DWM-Sweden

Here a short entry on Municion.org:


DwmKk431hG

This is the first of the so called DWM case #431 ‘Swedish Experimental’ series (see article). Only known with "DWM K 431H K " hs without letter date codes which implies manufacture prior to 1925. Listed sometimes as 7.4x59 but commonly referred to as 7.2x59.

This is a very rare cartridge and I personally only know of four examples (??) confirmed as existing; two in the Woodin Laboratory Collection, one from Nils Olsson and one from Austria. There are likely to be others but I suspect not that many.

An undated but c1912 DWM Factory drawing of this case type exists (see images). This drawing is titled “Versuchs-Munition für das Schwedische Gewehr Kal. 7,2mm.” (“Experimental ammunition for the Swedish rifle Kal. 7.2mm.”). This is where the “Swedish Experimental” title is probably derived.

*************** DWM case #431 Series
DWM began a series of cases (#431 series) commencing c1895/1896 based on the 6.5x55 Swedish case (SC64). This case uses a c12.2mm base noticeably larger than the M88 Mauser type.

The first of the DWM431 series was the 6.5x55 Swedish M94 military caliber (case #431). All lettered sub-series of this series utilised the same base as the original 6.5x55 case (c12.2mm base). The letters H-M (c1912 - 1933) are referred to as “Swedish” in the DWM case book but what their actual relationship to Sweden is unconfirmed. It is believed that they were originally an experimental military series possibly designed to replace the 6.5x55. These cases were all unique types, some of which were listed commercially.

A DWM factory drawing of the case #431K is known dated 30 August 1913 helps to establish the introduction dates of these cartridges. The full list is as follows:

case# exists Date Caliber and Notes
431 1896 6.5x55 Krag-Jorgensen M94
431A 1896 6.5x55 Rottweil - probably loaded with Rottweil powder
431B 1896 6.5x55
431C yes 1896 6.5x55 Mauser M96 - common commercial 6.5x55 cartridge
431D yes 6.5x55 Luxembourg - Military loading for Luxembourg
431E ? 6.5x55 Swedish
431F yes 1905 6.5x55 Swedish M05
431G 6.5x55 for SFM - loading for the French Company SFM.
431H yes c1912 7.2x59 Swedish (W47)
(Note Germans do not use the letter “I” - ie. No 431I used)
431J yes c1912 7.5x59 Swedish (W48)
431K yes 1913 6.5x58 Swedish (W44)
431L yes c1924 6.5x61 Swedish -commercial use listed till at least 1939 (W45)
431M yes 1933 6.5x61R Swedish - rimmed 431L (W46) - ‘N N’ codes= 1933
431N yes c1933 No case is known to have been designated to this number
May be the 6x61 Hof-Mann Express (W71) based on the 6.5x61
431O yes c1933 No case is known to have been designated to this number
Maybe the 6x61R Hof-Mann Express (W72) based on the 6.5x61R
431P yes 1937 5.6X61 Vom Hofe (W27) - First date code ‘M M’ = 1953
431Q ? No case is known to have been designated to this number.
May have been allocated to another Vom Hofe prototype.
431R yes 1937 5.6X61R Vom Hofe (W28) - First date code ‘M M’ = 1953

******************************see also
6.5x61 Swedish Experimental

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WBD, thank you for your insight!

The designation of “experimental cartridge” in Sweden comes from the Swedish box for these.
As it appears to be full there must be more than 4 such cartridges.

Can you please show us a picture of the box ?

Unfortunately I can not as it is not my copyright and I have no idea who is the author of the image.

But the exact marking is:

10
7,2mm Sk. Försökspatroner
med TORPEDKULA
Karlsruhe 1914
Krut: Troisdorf
Ompaketerade Marieberg 1914

Means these were made in 1914 by DWM Karlsruhe and were repacked the same year by the Arsenal in Marieberg (Sweden).
Loaded with boat tail projs. and Troisdorf propellant

Thanks for this, what did the hs of the contents show ?

Headstamp is the one above. I assume there is only one known.

So you actually saw the hs, you didn’t just assume it was “DWM K 431H K” because “there is only one known”.

Sorry for seeming so pedantic but there is nothing in the label that indicates that it is the 7.2x59 which but just a 7.2 mm Test Cartridge which is just a 7mm. It could be a 7x57 or a 7mm version of a 6.5x55 with a special bullet. If you couldn’t see the hs it might be:

image

The hs photo came with the box image + an image showing a full cip of 5.
The hs there was exactly like the one on Municion.org where I took it from and posted it here as I could not use the original images.
So I am pretty sure the hs in the Swedish box is correct.

When I first saw the photos and the “7.2mm” on the box I also thought that this could be a flaw by somebody in Sweden who measured the bullet diameter and used it on the box. But after I checked the case number in the DWM catalog the 7.2x59 were confirmed since the bullet diameter there is given with 7.4mm. So noone in Sweden missinterpreted the caliber.

If your “DWM 1914” headstamp is not a confirmed 7.2x59 I’d recommend to delete the images as that may seriously misslead readers of the thread here.

Thanks for clearing that up.

Now, regarding copyright:
I see that the page on municion.org that you have used is marked “Copyright” and yet you had no issue using those images? Why are you reluctant to use the others you have. If they are from the Internet then you can just send us a link. If not then it is from a book and if it is marked Copyright or © then it should have who the Copyright is registered to. If not you should be able to use it and even if copyright is claimed unless it’s registered properly writing “Copyright” or © means nothing !

The images I got were relayed to me and I do not know who is to be asked or credited.

The image source for the hs above I clearly gave. Also it is from an open source, i.e. the internet.

Why are we running this discussion?

Because, a full (or nearly full) box of “DWM K 431H K”, even if not in a DWM box, is un-precedented and needs to be verified. It would also affect the future sale of this $300+ cartridge.

Maybe, but I did not open the thread here to discuss the development of prices or justify those being asked today. And with 4 known cartridges I wonder if any will become available soon. And those 10 in that box may remain where they are. Who knows?
I am just interested in the technical and historical background. This is the good part in not collecting.

The rifle and three 10-round boxes exists in one collection. They are not for sale! Two boxes are not opened (1913 and 1914), one box is opened (1914).

Hi Costas. Nobody is asking if they are for sale !

What would be great is a photo of the box sides and also the cartridge and it’s headstamp from the box that is opened. That is all that I have been after.

Thanks

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Hi Costas, thanks for these images. These are certainly the correct hs however there appears to be something unusual about these cases.

Apart from these cases clearly being reloaded with some unusual and messy crimping, the necks don’t appear to be square and as you can see in the following image, the shoulder does not match the standard DWM case #431H (the four examples at the top) .

The neck length appears to be 1-2mm longer and the shoulder is a larger amount lower. We would need case measurements to be sure but if this cartridge chambers correctly in the rifle (I assume it is this one ? 7.2x59 Swedish Test Cartridge Rifle) then it is likely that the chamber is not made for a standard DWM #431H case.

So maybe the 7mm Swedish tests used a modified DWM #431H case rather than the standard case ??

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The basic dimensions of samples in clip are… ?
But the samples in clip looks as common 7 x 57 Mauser with longer bullets…
If is diam. of base 12 mm, case lenght is then about 65 mm and total lenght is cca. 96 mm. These are approximate dimensions from photo.

WBD! This photo was taken by iPhone at close (short) range, so there is a lot of aberration.

yes, but anyway…the quality of the bullet fixture in the case is never ever DWM-like…I think more, that this are exp.loads at the swedish location where they where packed, or repacked for some tests…
I have a decent DWM collection and had never seen such a relative crude bullet fixture…and I have a lot of 431 xxx loads, from swedish, to Luxemburg and Vom Hofe issues…
pp

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