7.62 x 51 Duplex & Simplex, Sectioned


#1

It’s been a while since we’ve seen any sectioned cartridges on the the Forum, so here are two for the price of one.

Left is a M198 Duplex, hs FA 65. It is loaded with two 84 grain bullets. Right is an XM256 E1 Low Recoil, hs FA 66. It is loaded with the top bullet only.

Though these two are from the mid-1960s, the concept of two or more bullets in one case is an old one, going back to the earliest cartridges. The U.S. tested multiplex cartridges, extensively, during PROJECT SALVO in the 1950s and what was determined then to be a not-so-good idea was still a not-so-good idea in the 60s. But using your tax dollars, our government is still at it, as we speak, and the idea just won’t die.

Ray


#2

I was under the impression that the M-198 was quite successful, but cost/politics killed the further production of the round. I recall CSAEOD having an interesting and informative opinion on this very subject.

AKMS


#3

Ray, I don’t know much about the background of the 1965 duplex load, but I know that the AF showed some interest in the load for use on gunships. I’ve been told by the old gunship crowd was that the first concept was a B-57 (USAF version of British Canberra) with an array of 7.62mm miniguns in the bomb bay aimed in different directions to cover a relatively wide area. The idea was that it would fly straight and level over an area and saturate it with fire. I was told at least one B-57 was modified and tested over the Eglin ranges, but this approach was dropped in favor of the C-47 gunships with three miniguns firing from the side. I was told that early on the AF liked the idea of a duplex round because it increased target saturation.

The low recoil round was developed through the initiative of Col Harold Burkett who was then with the CIA and working on arms that would be more approprate to small statue Asian soldiers than the then current western weapons. He worked on a new series of loads for M1 carbines with a different bullet for increased lethality which were field tested in Laos. The purpose of the Low Recoil 7.62mm was to allow use of the M60 to be more easily handled by Asian soldiers. Burkett said it was also field tested. As far as I know neither the 30 Carbine load (which I wrote up in the Journal some time ago) and the low recoil 7.62mm were taken beyond operational testing in combat.

Cheers, Lew


#4

I measure success by a cartridge actually being adopted and used in a front-line capacity on a regular basis. The 45-70 and the 30-06 were successful (among others). The multiplex cartridges have been around for at least 140 years and none have been successful, IMHO.

OK, pile on. :) :)

Ray


#5

[quote=“Lew”]
He worked on a new series of loads for M1 carbines with a different bullet for increased lethality which were field tested in Laos. The purpose of the Low Recoil 7.62mm was to allow use of the M60 to be more easily handled by Asian soldiers. Burkett said it was also field tested. As far as I know neither the 30 Carbine load (which I wrote up in the Journal some time ago) and the low recoil 7.62mm were taken beyond operational testing in combat.

Cheers, Lew[/quote]

Lew, is there an image of that .30 M1 carbine round available? You made me curious. (I do not have the old journals)


#6

The Carbine round was called the Mod 1.1 as I remember. Am away from home for the next 3 weeks. It has a slightly flattened bullet tip. The final version was FMJ with a thin jacket and loaded with a core of compressed lead shot. Hal Burkett told me that a Laotian Sgt got 27 one-shot kills in a row with this round in a 30 carbine. remind me and I will try to get a photo. This cartirdge isn’t obvious.

Cheers, Lew


#7

Thanks a lot Lew that is very interesting, I have seen the Hmong (those Laotians firghting alongside the US those days) in 1998 and one was till carrying his .30 M1 Carbine. He was kind enough to show me his ammo for it and it was all US made in the 1950’s. I wish I had this info ten years ago.