7.62x54R Chinese Type 53 - WHITE tip?


#1

Everything I’ve been able to find on the Chinese 7.62x54R indicates they loaded a round in the 1950s equivalent to the Warsaw Pact 147gr LPS light ball, calling it the “Type 53” . . . which is identified with a gray or silver tip. This, however, is very definitely WHITE paint - at most, “not quite Titanium white,” with no hint of gray or silver.

Is it simply a color variation or am I overlooking some sort of specialized load here?

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#2

Teak, I’m pretty sure this is just a color variation. I’d have to check, but I’m pretty sure that the sectioned example of a Chinese LPS ctg. in my collection is one of these white tipped rounds.

AKMS


#3

Teak, what’s the date? The Chinese produced weapons assembled, all or in-part, from Soviet components. Perhaps your round is a similar example of “Socialist Fraternal Cooperation”?


#4

Headstamp is 81 57

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#5

AKMS, it is pure white on purpose.

These white tipped ones are that what we know from the Russians as LPS.
Please note that China at some point broke away from the USSR politically. After that the Chinese changed their color codes.


#6

The political break between the two was in 1953. Your 1957 date, unless loaded using old bullet stock, throws out my theory.


#7

Jon, thank you for telling the year. Can anyone tell by his Chinese cartridges what year the color code was changed then? Means has somebody two years in a row with different colors on one and the same type of Projectile? (the Russian being the older of course)


#8

Me again, had a look at available specimen and found out so far that the color code change likely happened from 1966 to 1967.
Cany anybody confirm this?


#9

The Chinese color codes on API and APIT changed around 1959. They retained the same color codes for tracer and I/T, so I am dubious about the theory that all the color codes changed for political reasons. It has been presumed that the change from a black/red color code for API to all black and the red/purple to all purple for APIT was simply a matter of simplifying production, nothing more. I still think that the white tip is simply a color variation for the LPS load and not significant of anything else.

AKMS


#10

I have an API from 1966 with the “Russian” code on. So 1959 seems to be too early for the change.

Are there any Chinese LPS with silver tip?


#11

Hi,

I have found a reference which may help to resolve some of the debate. Then again, maybe not.

The reference is the Small Caliber Identification Guide, Volume I, August 1984. I have gotten more good from this guide than any other reference that I own.

The reference states with regard to China, Section IV, page 74:

“China adopted the Soviet bullet tip color coding with the introduction of the Soviet-type weapons and ammuntion in the 1950s. Because China makes fewer functional types in each caliber, there is no need for a full range of bullet tip color codes; for this reason China, starting in 1967, simplified the color coding of cartridges. As an example, China makes only one ball cartridge in caliber 7.62x54R; designated the Type 53, this cartridge is a copy of the Soviet LPS in this caliber.”

Table II on page75 lists the functional codes and a white or silver bullet tip for 7.62x54R caliber designates “Ball (mild steel core) Type 53.” The Type 53 API (black tip, red ring) is listed as pre-1967 and API after 1967 is listed as black tip only.

Hope this resolves some of the discussion.

Heavyiron


#12

Heavyiron, thanks a lot, have that manual too (should have checked that). So my assumption about 1967 was right.


#13

EOD,

My statement of 1959 as the year the color codes changed is incorrect. I should have looked at my notes instead or relying on my memory (which is getting worse as I get older!). Let’s also determine the year that the color code was dropped entirely on the Chinese LPS types. I have seen more than a few LPS cartridges from China with no tip color at all.

AKMS


#14

AKMS,
Yes, this is an interesting question. I think those collecting the cartridges by years can tell us in detail.

The russians dropped the “LPS” marking (silver tip) in 1978 since there was no ball with leadcore anymore. The “L” (lead core) remained in service till 1968, maybe production ceased earlier, but when?


#15

the color is blue, and it’s HPT


#16

I’m sorry - I don’t understand. The tip on the one I have is very definitely white.

.


#17

[quote=“Iconoclast”]Everything I’ve been able to find on the Chinese 7.62x54R indicates they loaded a round in the 1950s equivalent to the Warsaw Pact 147gr LPS light ball, calling it the “Type 53” . . . which is identified with a gray or silver tip. This, however, is very definitely WHITE paint - at most, “not quite Titanium white,” with no hint of gray or silver.

Is it simply a color variation or am I overlooking some sort of specialized load here?

.[/quote]

The silver and white rounds are all the same type- steel core similar to German 7.9 SME.


#18

I’m sorry - I don’t understand. The tip on the one I have is very definitely white.

.[/quote]
Type 53 7.62mm have two classes HPT, one is blue and another is gray.


#19

I have owned and do now own MANY of these and they are WHITE tips. Mine are Hungarian. CWS. 21 52.


#20


no white in chinese cartridges