7.62x54r "sniper" ammunition


#1

Did anyone besides the USSR/Russia make a dedicated “sniper” cartridge in 7.62x54r?

AKMS


#2

AKMS, good question.
Finland made plenty of “Match” cartridges which served as sniper ammo. Also there is such ammo in military packing saying “Tarkkuuspatruuna” (D166p projectile) made by Sako.
The Czechs had some with a stamp on the box saying “Odst.” which was explained to me to be sniper ammo.
Following the Yugoslav color codes and the purple PA which stands for sniper ammo there should be also a sniper cartridge if they did not change the meaning (have seen such a cartridge).


#3

The head stamp from this round is 188 82
There is written on the label in German, “sporting rounds”.
The ammo comes from East Germany. Well I don’t know if the ammo came from Russia or loaded in the former DDR with Russian components.

Perhaps EOD or Hans knows more.

Rgds,
Dutch


#4

Dutch, these are match cartridges made in the USSR by LVE in Novosibirsk.


#5

… and are SAID to be Nationale Volksarmee surplus, originally for sniper units use.


#6

I wonder how this has worked since the 7N1 at 9.7 gram projectile weight was adjusted to the Dragunov (SVD) sights and the match cartridges from LVE range at 13 grams.
The Russian MIA is using the match cartridges for their bolt action sniper rifles but there the sights are suitable for the projectile weight. The GDR had in 7.62x54R only the SVD.


#7

EOD,

thank you for those facts, then I can take hearsay: “… and are SAID to be …” out of my files. Do you have an idea whom they had the 9,7g projectiles for?


#8

It was implied by the seller that this one may have had “sniper” applications. I’m not much up on this caliber so thought I’d give it a shot here…

Headstamp looks to be “21” over “72”.

These come in what I think is a (12) round string tied treated paper package with a slip of paper that might be some form of “quality control” tag.

Any confirmation of the load, origin, etc. would be great.

Thanks,
Dave


#9

[quote=“Hans”]EOD,

thank you for those facts, then I can take hearsay: “… and are SAID to be …” out of my files. Do you have an idea whom they had the 9,7g projectiles for?[/quote]

Hans the 7N1 was developed with 9.7 gram to be exchangeable with regular LPS cartridges in case no sniper ammo was on hand. So the trajectories had to match.
Also noticebale is that the “new” (adopted in 1999) 7N14 SNB sniper AP cartridge is a sniper and MG cartridge. This is underlining the “dual use” and the concept behind a standard projectile weight.


#10

Dave your’s is a Hungarian “heavy ball” which is a MG cartridge for “indirect fire”. So unless the Hungarians had special sniper rifles (no SVDs then, they came later) adapted to the heavy projectile I tend to believe that this is just a MG cartridge.


#11

Thanks, EOD,

Yup. forgot to add it in my post, but I had this one as Matravideki Femmuvek Sirok, Hungary, Boat Tail, Heavy Ball which sounded like it ought to be a standard load and assumed the “sniper” part to be a bit of “sales hype”. A nice “purty” color tipped round, none the less…

Dave


#12

Dave

Funny how things work out! I had just scanned this round with a 21 73 headstamp, then I saw your post and the replies. Now I don’t have to do any research on it!


#13

I once saw this ammunition advertised on an online auction site as “sniper” ammo brought back from the Vietnam War.

AKMS


#14

This heavy steel core bullet was made in Bakony Művek, Veszprém. It was used for machine-guns mixed with other types.

7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinAmmo.htm

Mihaly


#15

Mihaly

You list the factory with the code 21 as “Bakony Művek, Veszprém”

In the headstamp section of the IAA website Factory 21 is listed as “Mátravidéki Fémmüvek Sirok, Hungary”. Is this an error? Since it appears that you are located at Veszprém, the factory should be just around the corner from you! Could you please let us all know the complete factory name and address.


#16

The IAA Site is probably a typographical error originally. The number “23” is Matrafem," not 21. It might have even been my error, as I did one of the original lists for the IAA - in fact, several lists. The IAA list needs a lot of corrections and additions. Some of the lists from the Eastern Bloc cartridges were based on information before the Warsaw Pact fell apart. We have learned a whole lot about East European ammunition since then.

IAA needs a committee or someone with the time and inclination (not me!) to make this list his own and keep it up to date and get it corrected. I made a list of corrections once, certainly not complete, but nothing was done with it to my knowledge and I did not keep a copy of it, as felt no need to.

The list as it is is not up to IAA Standards, in my humble opinion. I say that as someone originally involved in it, but like I say, there have been a jillion new headstamps show up since then, and we have much more information now than we had even two or three years ago.

John Moss


#17

I have the same box like Dutch have but I have 2 more different …


#18

Phil,

In Veszprém the ammunition factory was founded on 1st September 1939 under the name Magyar Lőszerművek Rt. During the WWII the following calibers were produced here: 9mm Luger, 9mm Mauser Export, 8x56R Mannlicher. At the end of the WWII the withdrawing German army took away the machines of the factory, that is why the production stopped for a while. On the headstamps of the ammunitions made in Magyar Lőszerművek the “ML(monogram)” sign was shown.

Production started again in 1951, when the factory worked under the name Bakony Művek Rt. Bakony Művek used code “21” from 1951-1989. During this period they produced the following calibers: 7.62x54R, 7.62mm Tokarev, 7.62x39, 9mm Makarov, 12,7x108(?). In 1989 they produced 5.56mm NATO ammunition as well, which headstamp was V 9.

Mátravidéki Fémművek used code “23”, and Andezit Művek worked in Jobbágyi used code “22”. There also was a factory in Téglás, where 12.7x108, and 14.5x114 ammunitions were produced with code “25”.

Mihály


Magyar Löszermüvek History and P (Hirtenberger) Headstamp Questions
#19

Mihály

Thank you very much for the information.