7.65 Mauser clips

Hello all,

I am looking for more information on the stripper clips meant for the Peruvian 1909, Ottoman 1903 and Paraguayan 1907 Mauser rifles. These are chambered in 7.65mm Mauser and have a special high hump stripper clip guide. The clips that are meant for these rifles have bumps on the sides, unlike the Belgian or Argentine 7.65mm clips. Does anyone have photos, drawings or information on the manufacturers?

Many thanks

Michael

Michael: From your post I’m not sure whether or not you are familiar with these clips. The two stop lugs on each side are only about a quarter inch apart so they are easily distinguished from all the other Mauser clips. Clips made for Turkey in particular should be available as relic finds but I recall no such examples discussed on the various forums. I think you will receive responses on this forum with images (which I cannot provide). Jack

SFM drawing No 7219F shows this charger and lists it as being used by Peru, it also has a note that “The trace is similar to No 7231C for Turkey.”

In a list published by FN in January 1934 they have Peru using their charger calibre 7,65 Model P2 which, from the drawing is very similar to the later Belgian types, with a more pronounced curve, a flat back and larger spring cut-outs and tabs … but with two close together lugs each side.

Peter

Edited for shoddy proof-reading and a silly mistake.

Peter: The reference to Chile using this clip is mysterious, as they were a consistent user of 7 m/m Mausers from the 1890s until well after WW2. Perhaps FN confused Chile and Peru? As to this clip with the close-set stop lugs I think it was intended to be interchangeable with the original lugless clip introduced with the Belgian 1889 and continued with various models in 7.65 m/m caliber used most significantly in Argentina and Turkey.

The lugless 7.65 m/m clip will work only with models of 1889, 1890, and 1891 along with the Argentine model of 1909. The lugged clip works with all Mauser rifles chambered for the 7.65 m/m cartridge. This characteristic follows from the fact that of the 7.65 m/m Mauser rifles of the 1898 pattern only the Argentine 1909 series has magazine well slightly narrowed at the rear to permit the lugless clip to stop on that surface. Trying to use a lugless clip in a Peruvian 1909, for instance, will result in the clip and cartridges being pushed into the magazine as a unit. Jack

Jack,

Sadly, not so … it’s reference to my inability to read through what I wrote and to spot a glaring error.

Thank you for pointing it out !

Peter

Peter: We all of us do do that from time to time. I have one of these clips, unmarked, which I thought SFM because it showed up about the same time as some SFM cartridges. But maybe it’s FN? Will compare it with your photos. Jack

Jack,

This clip came out of a previously unopened box of 1930’s FN ball ammunition … the only way to pin down any of their clips.

I also have them marked DM in a cartouche and with a “script P”. It’s not a calibre of rifle you see in the hands of UK shooters, in 30 years of doing Service Rifle competitions I can’t remember seeing one, so ammunition and the clips that go with it are collectors items … and thus quite scarce. My four differently marked ones all came from European ECRA meetings.

Peter

Peter: My unmarked specimen is close enough to your known FN clip that I am willing to ID it as ‘FN?’ and lose no sleep. Still wonder where the Turkish clips went to. Jack

I’ve had a look through my notes and on SFM drawing No 7237D, dated June 1914 the title is Chargeur pour Fusil Mauser calibre 7,65 du Gouvernement Ottoman. The drawing is an exact representation of the SFM marked charger I show above.

If these were production, rather than merely illustrative drawings then the date is close enough to the declaration of war between the Allies and Germany at the beginning of August 1914 that they might never have been produced, or if they were, that they weren’t delivered. Also, Turkey was formally allied with Germany by the Turco-German Alliance itself of August 1914, although Turkey didn’t declare war until October or the year. Much was in flux at that time.

Does anyone know about Turkish arms purchases overseas at that time … and also about Turkish disposal of military goods since ?

Peter

Peter, this clip is found in Spanish language boxes by FN dated between 1935 and 1954, all with cartridges loaded with S bullets.

The SFM contract for Turkey using this clip also included details of two different headstamps, one marked 19 S.F.M 14 GG and the other using Arabic letters with an “F” to identify the source (i.e., France) and dated 1330 (1911-12).

Regards,

Fede