7.65x54 mauser box


#1

Hello everyone.

I present a beautiful cardboard box with 100 cartridges manufactured in Holland for Argentina.

Contains AP - Armor piercing cartridges 7.65x54 Mauser

Regards

Sergio


#2

There is 9mmP from the early 1930s packed in boxes marked Dordrecht using Hirtenberg marked cases. I have heard opinions that the ammunition was totally manufactured in the Netherlands and others that Dordrecht was only a loading facility for Austrian made components. Josef Motz probably answers this question in his book, but I don’t have access to it just now.

Can anyone confirm the manufacturing activities that went on at HP Dordrecht?

Cheers,
Lew


#3

SMR,

Can you possibly provide a good picture of the headstamp.

Thanks,

Brian


#4

I can clearly see “HP” at 6 o’clock in the head stamp…

AKMS


#5

[quote]There is 9mmP from the early 1930s packed in boxes marked Dordrecht using Hirtenberg marked cases. I have heard opinions that the ammunition was totally manufactured in the Netherlands and others that Dordrecht was only a loading facility for Austrian made components. Josef Motz probably answers this question in his book, but I don’t have access to it just now.

Can anyone confirm the manufacturing activities that went on at HP Dordrecht?

Cheers,
Lew[/quote]
Lew, wish I knew this because it is related to several Argentine ammunition contracts. The information mentioned in Mötz’s book is not very precise on this subject and this is not explained in Argentine contracts documentation either. No distinction is made between what was manufactured and what was loaded at Dordrecht.

Here is a checklist of headstamps found in Argentina coming from Dordrecht labeled boxes:

7.65x54:
19 F y A 26 H. P.
19 F y A 27 H. P.
19 F y A 28 H. P.
19 F y A 29 H. P.

No space between "H.P."
19 F y A 27 H.P.
19 F y A 28 H.P.

Uppercase “Y”, no dots between "H P"
19 F Y A 28 H P
19 F Y A 33 H P
19 F Y A 38 H P

[b]19 F Y A 32 D

19 F Y A 34 P[/b]

7.63 mm Mannlicher:
H.P. 1932

9 mm Parabellum (not for Argentina):
P * 1934 *

.45 ACP:
HP 1928
H P 1 9 2 8
HP * 1933 *

There are also 7.65x54 and 9 mm Parabellum cartridges headstamped P * * but no manufacturer is mentioned in the box. These were used in the Chaco War.

Additions and corrections are most welcome.

Regards,

Fede


#6

Brian,

This is the photo of the headstamp.


#7

SMR,

Thank you for the headstamp photo.

Nice box!

Brian


#8

According to Mötz’ bi-lingual book “Hirtenberger AG. The first 150 years” Dordrecht was set up in 1926 and produced until 1934. According to him the company hat 13 complete machine sets, made up partly by machines from Hirtenberg and bought from Germany. Mötz expressly says that Dordrecht was able to do all steps in cartridge manufacture.


#9

Jochem, thanks you very much for indicating this reference, and I wonder when exactly the full production line was adquired. Maybe the cartridge headstamped 19 F Y A 32 D was the only one entirely produced at Dordrecht? This is a very rare headstamp, in any case.

Just to avoid confusion, the headstamp 19 F Y A 38 H P is not a mistake but evidently was not produced at Dordrecht. I have never seen its box but it was included in the checklist because it follows the same headstamp pattern. Also, it is the only post-1934 7.65x54 cartridge made by HP that is found in Argentina.


#10

Sergio nice box, and nice items in very good condition.

You’re a lucky man.

Saludos amigo.


#11

Very nice box, thanks for sharing!

Joe


#12

I have also this empty box, but what means the LP (Lichtspoor/Leuchtspur/tracer)?


#13

cal .45 ACP ball , dummy and case




#14

Harry, nice boxes, the “LP” marking indicates “Luminosa Perforante” (Luminous Piercing) and translates as “Armor Piercing Tracer”. This designation was used to differentiate flame tracers from smoke tracers bullets.

Cartridges are identified by means of a bright green tip.

Regards,

Fede


#15

Thanks Fede for the quick answer do you have a pict of that cartridge ?


#16

Here is a sectioned cartridge:

iaaforum.org/forum3/viewtopi … =8&t=14236