7.92 x 57 questions


#1

Gents,

Their will probably be very basic answers on very common cartridges here, but as i know nothing about 7.92 x 57 rounds, you’ll have to forgive me…

Of the two rounds pictured above;

The left (live / complete) round has a copper colour case and a similar colour bullet, both of which accepts a magnate.

I assume the case is copper washed steel with an (?SmK?) bullet?

The annulus seal is green with 3 stab crimps on the primer, as can be seen in the photo of the headstamp shown below…

Headstamp reads: P315 Xr1 2 40

The fired case on the right I am let to believe was recovered from a Messerschmitt Bf 109E-4 of I/JG53 (Brittany) which was shot down on Sept 15th 1940 over south Kent

Headstamp reads: P163 S* 10 38

The first of these rounds came from a bag of mixed surplus i aquired, the fired case i was given as a child mounted on a small plaque alongside a small piece of the aircraft fusilage.

I know most of the information regarding 7.92 x 57 is found on the carton labels, as demonstrated by recent threads on the forum, but can someone try to identify the type of rounds these are / were, for me please.

Many thanks.


#2

Here is the information I can give you:

Cases made by:

P315 - M


#3

I don


#4

The bent neck on the fired 7.92mm case is typical of ammunition from a crash. On impact, the inertia of the bullet will bend the neck if the rounds are pointed at an angle to impact. In England a Lancaster crashed just behind the little airfield at Booker where we lived in RAF housing. My two boys took a metal detector and found quite a bit of wreakage including foot plus bits of structure, much of it with the paint and letters still on. there was also quite a few 303 casings. most had the necks bent over at 90 degrees, clearly from guns pointing sideways on impact. There were also cases with the bullet pulled (from the guns pointing forward) and some with the bullet pushed down hard against the cordite (from the guns pointing backwards on impact). The ammo system on he Bf-109 has the 7.9 ammo basically pointing forward. It looks to me as if the aircraft impacted at about a 10 degree angle which would result in the bent case you have.


#5

Lew - great information. I never even thought about damage to the cartridges through a crash - much more logical when you figure that the case has come into the hands of a collector. Had the plane landed in Germany and had a jam cleared, on retrospect, it would have been scrapped, and not likely ever seen the light of day again.

You mentioned the boys finding “foot.” Please don’t tell me they found a human foot in the debris they dug up! ("…and found quite a bit of wreckage including foot plus bits of structure…").