9 mm Para Identification Questions

At SLICS I acquired a German-made 9 x 19 mm Para cartridge with a headstamp I had not seen before. The headstamp is in the basic pattern required now by the German military, and is: 9x19 SAT16D0000

The cartridge is brass-case, brass primer cup with red primer seal, and a brass-jacket, non-magnetic FMJ bullet. The bullet ogive is a bit more rounded (blunter) than what I am used to seeing on 9 mm ball cartridges made in Germany. Total cartridge weight is 190.8 grains (approximately 12.40 grams), which would indicate the bullet alone weighs approximately 124 grains.

Several questions come to mind:

  1. Who actually made these cartridges?
  2. Who were these cartridges made for?
  3. What does “SAT” stand for (perhaps the name of the manufacturer)?
  4. The cartridges were made in 2016, and are a “D” classification loading. What type of loading does “D” specify?
  5. Why is the manufacturer’s Lot Number “0000?”

I have only once before seen a lot number composed of nothing be zeroes (000) and that was on the pre-production trial lot of CCI 9 mm Para rounds made for the French. That is confirmed, as is the headstamp. I have it in my own collection.

Quite frankly, I was told at the show what the SAT stands for, but can’t find the note I made - not usual for me at a big and busy show.

Hope someone can help.

John Moss

Hi John,

All I can add is that the “SAT” headstamp is used by Saltech of Switzerland for some of their headstamps (instead of “ST”). I don’t know if they actually manufactured this cartridge or who was the customer. The idea of a sample lot sounds likely, but I can’t confirm that either. Letter “D” stand for April (2016).

I hope others can help you with more information.

Saludos,

Fede

John, this may shed more light onto the subject.

The Lot number is along the US/NATO lot numbering system. Discussed here in detail before.

The lot being given as “0000” on already 2 calibers is odd. I wonder if these are pilot lots which were routed to the commercial market then.

Thank you both for your efforts. Fede - I thought the letter identified the cartridge type. It is good that now have the right information about that.

Alex - what is the other caliber from Saltech that has a 0000 lot number?

Looking at it again, but bullet is more the shape of most Swiss 9 mm Para rounds, although the cartridge headstamp has the “look” of German - DAG or MEN. I think DAG is part of RUAG, while MEN is owned by CBC of Brazil. Is that still the case?

John Moss

John, the other “0000” ids as in the link I gave a 7.62x51.

You are correct about DAG/RUAG and MEN/CBC.
But Saltech is a competitor to both and as you may remember from other discussions here they are getting lots of components from Igman and recently Hungary but on the latter my inquiry here brought no details.

They are also manufacturing some cartridges themselves, like 7.62x51 and .50 Cal. (12.7x99).

Fede, the 12.7x99 I saw so far had Igman cases no?

I will do some more comparison of the bunter letters, color of PA, bullet shape, etc. Right now, my opinion would lean towards Hungarian manufacture by MFS, at least of the case and possibly the complete rounds. I am referring only to the 9 mm. While the headstamp on that 7.62 x 51 NATO round with “0000” lot number is the same format and basic content, the primer seal and the lettering looks little like that of the 9 x 19 cartridge I have. It does seem odd, though, that if SALTECH and RUAG are competitors, that a RUAG company would make ammunition for SALTECH.

thanks for all the added information. It will help. I will also compare the cartridge to Igman 9 mm rounds I have.

John M.

Alex, they are making their own from scratch in new Manurhin machinery since as early as 2017, maybe earlier. The president of Saltech is part of the Manurhin group since 2016.

Fede, ok, so they had changes recently.
Do you happen to have seen the “own” hs on their .50s?

I am still puzzled by that info on them drawing stuff from Hungary.