90mm Question


#1

Hello all. I have a 90mm steel dummy that Im finally working on. Base screws off, h/s as far as I can read [after cleaning] in JKM 1943 DRILL 90MM 12B…Thats the best I can read it. Some parts I cannot read. Any Ideas, Naval, or land artillery?

Thanks
Steve


#2

An image might help here. Might be AA or tank gun.


#3

Here is a photo before cleaning.

Thanks

Steve


#4

Might be for one of those:

M2 AA gun
olive-drab.com/idphoto/id_photos_90mm_aaa.php

Also been used in the M26 Pershing and M10 Volverine (Slugger) and later on in the M48 Patton.


#5

Steve

From the profile, I suspect it is replicating the M71 series of the 90MM. TM 43-0001-28 shows the variations. This round was used “against personnel and material, producing blast and fragemntation at the target”. So, my WAG is Army/land based.

Rick



#6

Thanks for the post guys! After cleaning the fuse it is marked FUSE DUMMY M44A2. Does that narrow the question down more? I also have a empty case that seems to match the dummy round, more on that later.

Thanks!
Steve


#7

The TM was from 1977. The AMERICAN ARSENAL has data pertinent to your shell’s timeframe. Highly recommened for your library, considering what I’ve seen you collecting. Here are the 90MM facts and figures for WW2 vintage M71s. Which is, in fact an M12 in the Drill configuration. The dummy fuse(M44A2) is correct for the round.


#8

Thanks Rick! The empty case I have has a h/s of 90MM-T24P LOT TPD-2-76 1953 I will post a photo tomorrow of this and the semi restored dummy.

Thanks!


#9

Steve,

Your drill cartridge is the 90mm M12B1 for the guns M1, M1A1 and M3.
The 90mm M12 is a bronze brass cartridge but was replaced by the iron steel 90mm M12B1.
This drill cartridge is not used in the 90mm M2 gun wich has a poweroperated rammer.

Source TM 9-1901 Artillery Ammunition 1944

Your 90mm T24 cartridge case is for the guns M36, M41 and M54.
There is also a steel 90mm T24B1 case.


#10

Straight from TM-9-1901 (1944 and 1950):

Pages 165 and 166 of TM-9-1901 Artillery Ammunition 1944.
201. CARTRIDGE, DRILL, M12, W/FUZE, DUMMY, M44A2, 90-MM GUNS, may be stamped either M12 or M12B1. Both are functionally alike and completely inert. However, the M12B1, which is being manufactured at present, is made of malleable iron and steel parts whereas the M12 is made of bronze and brass parts. Both are 1-piece castings threaded at the base to receive the base plate and at the nose to hold the M44A2 Dummy Fuze. The base plate is held in position by a set screw; the fuze, by a set screw and shoe arrangement. Bothe parts are replaceable. FUZE, dummy, M44A2, used with this cartridge, may be made of bronze, brass, aluminum, copper alloy or sintered iron. In form, the casting resembles the M43 Fuze but is without the time ring. The complete assembly weighs 39.15 pounds, and is 37.44 inches long. This drill cartridge is not used in the 90-mm M2 Gun which has a power-operated rammer.

TM-9-1901 Artillery Ammunition 1950, page 187:
156. Cartridge, Drill, M12B2, w/Fuze, Time, Mechanical, M43A2, Inert, for 90-mm Guns M1, M1A1, M1A2, M2, M2A1, M3, M3A1, and T8
The M12B2 drill cartridge, which is the standard type, consists of a body of manganese bronze, a steel base, and an inert M43A2 fuze. Weight of the complete round is 42.04 pounds. Earlier models designated M12 and M12B1 (M12B1 is made of malleable iron) were assembled with dummy fuze M44A2 and are usable except in guns with power rammer. Malleable iron cartridges are not to be used under any circumstances in guns with automatic rammers. Bronze cartridges may be used in all of the above weapons. When used in the M2 or M2A1 guns, the power rammer will be made inoperative and the cartridge will be rammed by hand.

Brian


#11

WOW! Thanks guys!

Steve


#12

Anyone know what the proper case length should be for the above dummy?

Thanks
Steve


#13

It should be 602mm.


#14

Thanks EOD!
Steve


#15

Ok I have completed the re finishing on the “case” portion of the above shell. Any Ideas what the projectile and fuse colors should be?

Thanks
Steve


#16

The entire round was left in natural color of the materials used, brass or steel, depending on which variation.

A light coat of oil or WD-40 will slow corrosion, or you could apply a coat of paste wax.


#17

I should have worded my question differently John. I have re-finished the dummy to look like a live round and need projectile and fuse colors to finish painting.

Thanks!

Steve


#18

Steve–That 90mm Drill is yours and you can do whatever you want to with it, but if it was mine I would leave it as it was issued. 90mm empty cases and TP projectiles (which you can repaint any color you want) are not that hard to find, but that Drill round is a lot more scarce in my opinion.