9mmP Securiblank by SNC Canada & other loads


#21

Vlim, I like your idea that the color of the plastic insert on the CQT rounds indicate the training system that it is used in. It also makes sense since on the SNC website they show weapons with a yellow bar down the side of the slide, and in other photos I have seen a blue color slide.

On the other hand, the two French language boxes in the original post have an identification number on the box label:
CAG: 0305 576 0010

This number is the same for both the white and the blue CQT loads and if they were for seperate systems, I’d expect the identification number or something else on the label to be different.

This CAG number looks like a National Stock Number (without the country code) but “0305” is not a valid number for a Stock Class as it would be if it was a Stock Number.

Does anyone know what this CAG number is and what it is used for??


#22

Thanks for your contributions.

Matching the color of the collar with the color of the training kit seems plausible. Although I’m wondering why the FX-cartridge doesn’t have a blue collar: the training kit for that cartridge is blue.

I’m going to mail the factory about this. If I get a response, I’ll post it here.


#23

I am not sure about this theory.

There is no mention about that on the website and with our law suit mentality nowadays one would expect this thing to be stated on the cartrdige boxes also. So far I haven’t seen such a box.

Here the SNC website:
simunition.com/cartridges/fx_training_en.php

On the website it says that there are 6 colors available - not 6 training systems (there will be certainly more than that).

The British Army manual on this cartridge is stating that 2 colors are available (adopted) but is not making any difference between them.

Just my thoughts.


#24

Back when I played with these, the assorted colors were used to differentiate shooters(and teams), which allowed for scoring, as it were. Also helped to ID Blue-on-Blue casualties ;-) The conversion kits came in one flavor for the SIG 226s we used.


#25

Vlim was talking about the CQT load which has a black plastic bullet, not a marking bullet, but the plastic case insert/pusher comes in three colors, white, blue and yellow. In fact, there is an opaque white and a translucent white (all four illustrated in the first post of this thread).

I understood Vlim’s question to be related to the color of these three insert/pushers, not the colors of the marker projectiles.

The pusher colors may indicate different materials, may be specific to different customers, may be related to different training systems, or something else. Asking the guys at SNC is a good idea.

Cheers,

Lew


#26

Oops. Maybe I oughta actually READ and COMPREHEND the post before replying.


#27

Lew, sorry, I missunderstood that before and thanks for clarifying.


#28

An NVBMB member already sent an e-mail with this question to SNC a couple of weeks ago and even they misunderstood the question: the answer explained the existence of different colored FX projectiles. Talking about confusing subjects! ;-)

I’ll let you guys know the response - if any.


#29

For the insert/pushers colours, in France we had the white, the blue and now, on the last lot, the yellow. This cartridges were and are all used with the same training systems.

For Lew : CAG is a typically french nomenclature code which is close to the Nato one (the first 4 numbers are the same). In general this two codes are jointly found on french ammunition box.

Box of FX with yellow insert/pushers: the NNO on top is the Nato nomenclature code:

Note: a nomenclature code for the french “Police Nationale” can also be found on this box.


#30

Domi, Thanks, that makes sense. I was confused because the two French boxes I had (posted in the front of this thread) are dated 1995, but the CAG has the first four letters of 0305 when the NSN stock class for munitions is 1305 as indicated on your box label. This must have been a misprint because these two boxes were with a batch of boxes marked prototype.

Thanks for the info—Nice box.


#31

hello Lew
It is not a misprint, but rather an error made in France when the specification were given to the supplier. We finds the same error on other batch of FX and also on batches of cartridges with Ball and QD1 bought at MEN for the Gendarmerie, at least from 1995 to 1999.


#32

domi, Why am I not surprised!!! I spent 35+ years in a big government organization and this sounds like many other stories I have heard!

Thanks for the excellent insight.


#33

Got a message from Mr. Luis de Sousa of Simunition…,

Sir,
In the past we did several colour iterations of the plastic sabot for the 9mm CQT


#34

Odd - with time, plastic colors can be corrupted. A milky white plastic aged often turns yellowish, and if faded, a yellow plastic would turn closer to a yellow/white tone. I would think the blue sabot much more clearly separated the two loadings. Just my humble opinion. A simple observation from a simple soul, and certainly adding nothing technical to this discussion.


#35

I noticed today from Simunition’s Facebook feed that they are teasing a new Gen-2 “Securi-blank”. It does look a little different, mostly in the hollow cavity. The only image they show is that of a souvenir challenge-coin with printed photo images of the new rds, which is probably for distribution at SHOT show next month.