9x19 Simunition


#1

Hi, All…Found 'em on the range…What are they ? Headstamp is IVI 90 9mm…We also found a loaded one…Randy


#2

It is ammunition for training, here is a link.

http://www.simunition.com/cartridges/fx_training_en.php


#3

These are made by Simunitions Inc. of Canada. They are a marker cartridge used by police in training. They are used in simulated gun fights and actually shot at the officers by each other - they wear some protective clothing and I am told they sting like the you-know-what when you get hit with one. They are made in different colors - I have red, blue, white, orange, green and yellow, pluse a couple of off-tone color variations that I guess were just tried out. They also make a blank with the same half-plastic case. The different colors are used so that they know who scored hits, I guess. The cartridges leave a colored smear on the “victim.”

The plastic part jumps partially out of the case when they are fired, and I guess this causes the case to act as a piston to operated a pistol. One day, I will fie a few in my Browning to see what they do. Have thought about it, but alwaqys forget when I go over to our shooting club. Should be interesting.

If you need any box labels for these, I will scan some and have my friend Joe post them later. Won’t bother if there is no interest in them. They don’t contain any information not already given.


#4

this type of ammunition is used for trainig with weapons modified with a special barrel and sometimes with a lighter bolt.
I try this type of ammunition is very interresting for training but is not a joke the impact if you don’t have protection can be dangereous.


#5

These have no powder, they are fired using the gases produced by the primer only. I had (have) a fired one of these, but pushed the white bit back in thinking someone had tried to remove it with an inertia puller. (oops!)


#6

That is not true. They do contain powder but only a small quantity. I’ve once sectioned such a round and also presumed that they did not contain any powder. I was unhappily surprised when some black, flaked powder felt out the cutting edge. I also presumed that it did not contain any powder but only a live primer.

Also, according to a factory data sheet I have, the 9mm variant contains powder but the .38 variant does not.

Added: according to an ammunition data sheet of the Royal Netherlands Army, the 9mm FX cartridge contains 0,017 grams of powder.


#7

You also don’t want to fire them in a firearm that hasn’t had the conversion kit installed, unless you enjoy clearing jams; the conversion kits (other than the revolver units) turn the firearms into straight blowbacks, that work sort of like the Colt Ace 22 kit.


#8

SDC - Thanks for the tip. I remembered something about special kits, but thought it possible (probable) that some of the departments would have just used them, even single-shot, in normal firearms. I wouldn’t consider that too safe - too much chance for an accidental loading of a live, ball round, but I rule out nothing when it comes to department-wide use of firearms. Some Police Agencies have a very high rate of ADs.

On your advice, I will NOT fire one in my stock Browning. In 15,000 rounds fired, I have never had to clear a jam with this fine pistol, so why start now? Thanks again for the heads up!

John Moss


#9

That is not true. They do contain powder but only a small quantity. I’ve once sectioned such a round and also presumed that they did not contain any powder. I was unhappily surprised when some black, flaked powder felt out the cutting edge. I also presumed that it did not contain any powder but only a live primer.

Also, according to a factory data sheet I have, the 9mm variant contains powder but the .38 variant does not.

Added: according to an ammunition data sheet of the Royal Netherlands Army, the 9mm FX cartridge contains 0,017 grams of powder.

[/quote]

Cheers Thijs, I didn’t think there was enough room for any powder in there, I will now have to try and use my inertia puller to get the platic part back out.


#10

Having fired one of these in an unaltered handgun, I can attest to the fact that a jam is guaranteed. The plastic protrudes into the throat/rifling and requires an appropriate length of rod to be tapped down the muzzle to eject the hull. I got to play “paintball” with these rounds and can assure everyone they are not a toy. The harder plastic and higher velocities can, and did, break the skin at close range. We wore some serious face/head protection as well as bulletproof vests. Arms and legs were left with welts and bloody spots. They functioned well in the converted SIG 220s we were using, but accuracy sucked. Good to maybe 15 feet. After that, they sorta spiralled off. No rifling in the barrels, but a very tight fit for the projectile. Again, not for play. They WILL put an eye out!


#11

Hi, All…Thanks to all for the info…I don’t collect 9mm but it’s always nice to know what things are…except I’ll probably forget !!! Randy


#12

Were these made from reject/reclaimed ball cases or new cases? The headstamps of the two I have are “SNC 95 9mm” and “IVI 01 9mm”


#13

The British company UTM (Ultimate Training Munitions) make a comparable range of ammo, in a variety of rifle and pistol calibres. I have a nice set of sectioned examples which I featured in the April issue of the ECRA Bulletin.


#14

Drawings crosses from there that I made


#15

Here the UTM website:
utmunitions.com/

and here the ammo part:
utmunitions.com/HTML/products.html


#16

Very nice link EOD :-)


#17

Thanks, but since when you are interested in “non Japanese” ammo?


#18

I have one these fired cases and got it from a reputable collector who said it was a sparkler used by moves to give the illusion of pistol FIRE. Did they come in different uses, loadings? Vic


#19

Vic - are you talking about the Simunition or the UTM? Yes, there are different loadings in each. Simunition makes, aside from the various colored-paint markers, a CQB round with black plastic bullet, and a blank, both with the half-plasitc case. UTM makes several types as well - markers, blank, etc. However, the description given you by the person who gave you your round is simply flat-out wrong, unless you have some form of one of these cartridges that has never been in their literature, and that most of us have never seen before. To tell that, a picture of your round would be required.


#20

Here is Simunition FX pic from my collection: