9x19mm DWM K 487 K hst from Swiss Meeting


At the Swiss meeting I picked up a 9x19mm with a normal DWM commercial 9mm Mauser headstamp. There are two punch stabs to hold the bullet in place and the mouth of the case has marks indicating it has been trimmed from a normal 9x25mm (9mm Mauser case). the bullet is magnetic and has marks above the case mouth indicating it had been cleaned on a wheel with a steel brush. On the side of the case was written:


At the meeting the consensus was that it was a fake. But, I was still interested since the obvious question is a fake of what??? Only the most naive would mistake this cartridge for the quite expensive DWM 487C.

I got home last evening late and the first thing I did this morning was to pull this bullet (pictures below).

The bullet is particularly interesting. It has two stab crimp marks well up from the base which match the marks on the case. Down toward the base of the bullet, and quite close to the base, are three crimp marks that are probably from the original loading of the bullet. In the bullet photo can be seen one of each type of crimp mark. The bullet weighs 114gr, less than the standard German P08 bullet (124gr), but very close to the weight of the standard British 9x19mm bullet introduced in the early days of WWII. The bullet looks like it was a 9mm Mauser bullet with the base trimmed off and a depression made in the base. Note that the jacket is cut off slightly higher than the base of the lead core.

The powder is nothing like the powder normally found in German P08 cartridges, but I have not done a comparison with my references.

Since British production of 9x19mm during WWII included both the Mk I and the Mk II, I suspect this cartridge was made as a joke and labelled the Mk 3 (non-existent as far as I know).

The cartridge was included with the items in the collection of an elderly Irish collector and would appear to be a good Irish joke! A joke that someone invested some time and energy to carry off!

Thought some of you might be interested.


Lew, the writing on the case is likely an abbreviation of the designation used by Erlmeier & Brandt for the 487C cartridge. If you take a look at vol. 1 p. 172 you will find it listed as “9 mm Mauser Versuch III / 9 mm Mauser Experimental Mk. III”. As you said, if intended as a reproduction of a 487C cartridge, is a very poor work. Regards, Fede.

A possibility Fede! If it is a replica/fake of the 487C then the weight is a dead giveaway since the bullet for the 487C was just over 125gr. The legit bullet was boattail with a recessed lead core. perhaps the depression was intended to represent the recessed core, but anyone seeing that couldn’t help noticing the lack of a boattail.

Who knows???