Aluminum 14.5mm case


#1

Gentlemen,

i recently got this case. It is a Hungarian 14.5x114 case by plant no.25 (Hajdus


#2

Vince,

I have no information for you on this, but actually am asking your for information. This is the first time I have seen Arsenal 25 of Hungary identified. Can you make a list of all the numbers used by Hungary on ammunition and identify each factory? I don’t believe there are so many, are there?

Forum masters - this identification and any other of the Hungarian arsenals needs to be added ASAP to the IAA headstamp list. I don’t know what has happened to that project, but this is important information. It is not often that those of us specializing completely in the former COMBLOC ammunition codes get one of these identified. For “25” we only have identified the Swedish use of it.


#3

Interesting case Vince, I suppose it never reached production as it would be much more costly than using steel.


#4

We had four arsenals in the cold war era which produced small arms ammo:

21 - Bakony M


#5

Vince - Great! Thank you.

Forum masters - we need to get this iinformation into our IAA Headstamp guide, before it is lost among the pages here!


#6

John, the “25” is known for a long time amongst medium caliber collectors.

Wasn’t there also a Hungarian 9x18 Makarov with an aluminum case? I heard of one some years ago but never got close enough to get the hs or evan an image.


#7

EOD - yes, there is a Hungarian 9 x 18m/m Makarov with aluminum case, with headstamp “21 67” loaded with FMJ GMCS RN bullet, and it has the primer cup completely covered with purpole lacquer, and a purple case-mouth seal. I wish it was mine. There is a specimen in the Woodin Laboratory Collection.

I apprecaite that some of the Hungarian arsenal numbers have been known to a few people who specialize in calibers they have appeared on. I didn’t know “25” and I wanted to get them somewhere where anybody could have access to the information.

I have heard of a Hungarian aluminum case in Tokarev as well - maybe Jon C. can enlighten us on that, and we can really make a story of experiments with aluminum cases in Hungary.


#8
  • @ strakv: What about the Hungarian plants “19” [37X155 ammo], “33” [propellants, TNT, charges, mines] and “51” [also propellant] ??? Liviu 02/14/09

#9

John, never heard of it!!!
Can you provide any more info? Any pics, H/S, etc?


#10

They are surely Hungarian, but we can only guess their location. 19 was probably in J


#11

Jon - I thought I heard about it from you. I cannot provide any more details, and if you have never heard of it, I may be wrong, about it being Hungarian, or it even existing.

Contact Bill Woodin and see if he has one. I remembered it being in relation to stuff he had picked up.

If I am totally wrong about its existence, I apologize. Senile old men shouldn’t draw anything out of their memories, I guess.


#12

Last St. Louis Uncle Bill got an aluminum-cased pre-war 7.63 Mauser round (* / * / * / * / ). Is that what you are recalling?


#13

[quote=“JohnMoss”]EOD - yes, there is a Hungarian 9 x 18m/m Makarov with aluminum case, with headstamp “21 67” loaded with FMJ GMCS RN bullet, and it has the primer cup completely covered with purpole lacquer, and a purple case-mouth seal. I wish it was mine. There is a specimen in the Woodin Laboratory Collection.
[/quote]

John, thanks a lot for the details!


#14

Jon et al. Yes, that is certainly what I was recalling. I don’t feel so bad now. I had forgotten the headstamp details completely, and between Hungary, the 7.62/63 x 25 case-type, and the fact that I knew Hungary made 9 x 18m/m Mak in the 1960s made me remember it being a Tokarev. I don’t feel quite so bad now - an error for sure, but not such a terrible one as it would be if Hungary never made any aluminum round in that case type.


#15

Hello!

A detailed study of all Soviet and Warsaw Pact ammunition manufacturer codes (in total approx. 380 different entries) is provided in my book on Soviet meduim calibre guns and ammunition. Of course also the Hungarian code No. 25 is included.

In my book I did not simply provide a list of code number and plant location (which was the usual and very unsatisfying way to do this until now), but went much deeper. Besides the code number or symbol I provide the full company name and address, the time span the company exists, a brief summery of the plant history, an exemplary list of specimens the manufacturer code was actually encountered on and the earliest and latest date this code was encountered on specimens. Because many Soviet plants moved during WWII from one location to another, one cannot simply say that plant No. 123 is from city XYZ!

Please note that in this way I do not only provide the manufacturer codes of cartridge cases, but also the codes of the producers of projectile bodies, fuzes, primers, powders, explosives and arms. Besides Soviet codes I also provide all the manufacturer codes from Bulgaria, Czechoslovakia, East Germany, Hungary, Poland and Romania. As outlined before, my Sooviet and Warsaw pact manufacturer code database comprises approx. 380 different entries and ammounts to a total of 32 pages in my book.

Please have a look on my webpage
russianammo.org
to find out more (table of content + sample pages for download) about and to order my book.

Chris Koll,
member of IAA and ECRA


#16
  • @ russianammo: Your new book MUST be very interesting! Liviu 02/19/09