Aluminum cased unknown


Have this unknown to me which came with some items bought at SLICS from the David Andrews estate (former CCI / Speer production manager among other things, but now deceased).

It has a “?” mark written on the case.

flat copper primer with an impressed "0"
8.08mm lead bullet which appears swaged not cast
turned aluminum case showing tool marks measuring
9.51mm rim
1,58mm rim thickness
8.77mm head
8.74mm mouth
28.8mm case length
36.78mm oal

total weight is 153 grains


Some kind of .32-ish magnum?


Thanks Jon
Makes sense, but doesn’t quite seem to match with anything I’m aware of.

I like to know if it was real or just some some guy trying out his lathe on a piece of aluminum. The primer is Remington (pretty sure), and is used is some of their factory reloads (also I think). However the case quality leaves a LOT to be desired.

Dave was a factory exhibition shooter and salesman for Remington before he came to Speer / CCI.


Pete - are you sure that Remington ever actually reloaded ammunition?

My understanding was that the “O” primer was a commercial product from
Remington. We never had any of them in the 36 years I worked at the SF
Gun Exchange, so I assumed that perhaps they were primers supplied in bulk
to reloading companies. Maybe a totally wrong assumption. However, I think
it would be a rare thing when major ammunition companies reload ammunition,
other than perhaps when developing new loads or calibers to sell. The “O” primer
shows up too often, in my view, to be in that category. I do notice that it is often
found on blanks which seem to be loaded (not necessarily reloaded, but rather on
new factory brass) by theatrical weapons suppliers, like Stembridge Arms. I
will have to, when I have time, see if I have this primer loaded into any case other
than Remington. It is possible also that it was used on factory primed brass for
ID (liability) purposes on cases sold to commercial reloaders, rather than to
individual shooter/reloaders. All just thoughts on my part. I have never made much
effort in documenting primers, which is likely a big mistake on my part.

I have no idea what that aluminum case is all about. Surprised it was in with any of
Dave’s stuff. Nothing about it looks like a CCI/Speer factory effort. The thick rim is
reminiscent of the .45 Auto Rim case. Can’t see any reason for its manufacture.

John Moss

PS" Actually, the character on the primer is shaped like a Zero digit rather than
an “O” and neither Pete nor I are referring to, or confusing it with, the Geco/RWS
Sinoxid primers with a circle (“O”) stamped on the cup.


Hi John
No, not sure at all about the reloading remark but you are more likely to be correct. However as you note it is a Remington product or so I thought.
Yes your right it’s nothing professionally done & very unlikely Speer /CCI or even Remington. It it quite crude and could have been something Dave, like all of us, just picked up along the way.

still I would like to know something about this as I think I’ve seen another.

By the way I’ve not seen a packet by anyone with these “0” primers in it.


I had not seen this oval on a copper primer before. I have seen the nickel primers on a homemade turned 9.3x72R, and a F A 46, 7.62x47. What other cartridges are known with the copper 0 primer?

Thanks, Dan


Yes, the only time I recall seeing that type of ‘0’ on a primer was on inert FA production.


Likely because they were used on cartridges outside of my collecting
specialty, I have never seen the impressed “0” on a copper primer. I have seen
the impressed “O” on both copper and brass RWS Sinoxid primers. I may
have others, but not important enough to search my whole collection, but
I do have four variations of 7.65 mmm Para (.30 Luger) blanks with the impressed
"0" (Zero) on NICKLE-CUP primers, however. They are all on "REM-UMC .30 LUGER
headstamped cases, but I believe they were actually loaded by Stembridge or one of
the other suppliers of theatrical blanks. It is possibly, though, that the cases were
received from Remington with the “0” primer. None of the cases appear have been
ever fired, hence not “reloads.”

John Moss


Thanks Jon and Pete,
Maybe John M. will know of others. Seems to me a .300 Savage rings a bell with the nickel one, but Pete’s copper is the only one of them I’ve seen. It will be interesting to see what else, either type have been seen on.



Well I took time & somewhat looked & in nickel primers I have as Dan notes a FA 47 ball load and also as a silver tipped INC. Also a .35 Whalen headstamped F A 3 7 and a .185 Winchester Expmtl. (see Hackley Vol 3)

So none in copper found so far. Looked in the wildcats where I thought they might be & movie blanks but no nickel or copper with a quick look.


CBC also use this 0 symbol on primers,supposedly to denote if the round was manufactured in Brazil or Germany but can’t remember which it is.



From: “O” or “0” on FA primer here is John Moss’s photo of the Remington 0 marked primers:


Could the “primer” actually be a rim fire case?