Assistance identifying cartridge from a chamber casting

Gentlemen,

I am trying to identify the correct cartridge for a Austrian double rifle.
Proof marks - Frelach Austria - 1892 to 1918.
12.8 on the bottom of both barrels
No nitro proofs and the rifling has no sharp corners.

That tells me we are looking for a 50 caliber / 12.8 mm black powder sporting shell used around the turn of the century.

To the casting. Some variance depending on where I measure them, my numbers could be off 0.2 mm or so.

Bore diameter 0.508 inches (12.8 mm)
Chamber length to rifling (no free bore) about 2.4 inches (63 mm)
Rim diameter, about 0.65 inches, (16.5 mm)
Diameter adjacent rim 0.58 inches (14.7 mm)
Dia at end of chamber 0.53 inches (13.5 mm)

Chamber has slightly steeper taper in in the first 1/2 inch by the head of case and then an even shallow taper to the case mouth.

I have looked at the DMG book and I suspect a 500 BPE in 2 or 2 1/4 in.
I see from other posts, there were several forms of the BPE depending the country of origin, but would suspect a continental variant given the country of origin.

Are their other possibilities I should be considering?

Can anyone provide photographs, drawings, images or other information on either cartridge from any country? Even catalog descriptions could be useful to me.

Thank you

Hi,

according to ECDV I found these two. But due to the reference Austria I would assume the first one is more correct.
Cheers

Jo


Perhaps 12.7x60Rmm D Express (500 Express 2-3/8 inch) from the 1880s ?

as the case is 63mm long, the assumption from Desperado is correct. Its the austrian version of a .500 (12,7 nominl) with that special configuration of the base part, which is different from the D- (german) Version, which exists only in 60 and 65mm, but not in 63mm.
The shown SOPER has nothing to do, with this chambercast at all…
PP

I agree,
The casting does have the Austrian base configuration shown in the first of the ECDV immages.
Unfortunately, the images are for a 450/ 11.6 mm bores, not 500/ 12.8 mm

Forensic, are you saying this is a 12.7 x 60 Austrian?

If so, where does one find more information?

Look again in the ECRA Dataviewer :

13 060 CBC 030

12,7 x 60 R D Express
.500 Express
.500 Express 2.3/8"
.500/60d Express
.500D/60/12,9
12,7 x 60 R Express
12,75 x 60,4 R
12,8 x 60 R
12,95 x 60 R D Express

Year 1880
Country Great Britain
Weapon Rifle, carbine
DWM 97
GR 240/44 240/237
Projectile Flat nose (ø 7), lead
Notes RWS Drawing M221
SAA 9155

-> Dixon EXP34 (1/63) - This cartridge was the most popular of the German “.500” “D” series being produced by at least six companies from Germany, Austria and Czechoslovakia where it was produced till at least 1948.
While this cartridge had no .500 case length equivalent that was produced in England, an RWS factory drawing of a “.500/60/Eley” type is known that had a less curved more ‘English’ type case (see EXP54).

etc

PS: The country is definitely not “Great Britain”

OK, l am a newbie so assume I am a bit off on the jargon

What does GR 240/44 240/237 refer to?
also (ø 7), not quite getting that either.

The rest seems to make sense, - names, age of shell, DWM 97,
I don’t have access to the ECRA data-viewer at this time.
A screen shot or two would be most helpful.

Question. If the chamber length to rifling is 2.4 inches, wouldn’t the case length be more like 56mm? Or am I missing something. Again.
Thanks,
Dan

56 mm is just shy of 2 1/4 inches.
With the 60 mm case should give me about 2 or 3 mm clearance to the rifling.

The ogive of the projectile would allow it to chamber with some of the point past the start of the rifling so that seems about right based on the images I have seen of similar projectiles.

Turned a false case head on the lathe tonight to check the head space. Rim thickness is right at 0.050 when the action closes. That is what my books report for a 500 nitro case rim. Diameter at the base is about 0.005 under nominal for the 500 nitro.

OK, Thanks. Your Chamber length to rifling dimension is closer to 63mm and not 2.4 inches. (61mm).
Dan