Australia and guns at the moment


#1

May be of interest.
In Australia at the moment, in the state of New South Wales there have been over seventy shootings in the last several months, mostly confined to western Sydney suburbs, they have been by criminals, drug deals gone wrong, territory desputes by Hells Angels etc.
The use of illegally imported hand guns [mostly Glocks] dominate but some use of fully automatic weapons as noted by police.
The police have had little sucess in prosecuting offenders but have confiscated a lot of hand guns and shut down an importing ring. Guns were imported from Germany mostly Glocks. Also many handguns come directly from Asia in the general mail as reported by police as our customs can only inspect about 3 to 5 per cent of entries into Australia.
For the first time the various governing and police bodies are putting the responsibility where it belongs, with the criminals and at this stage are not acting with a knee jerk reaction to alter or tighten existing gun laws in that state. The elected government may even be beginning to trust those that elected them.
And public comment to newspaper articles is generally in the honest firearm owners and users favour.
[color=#800000]This may be marking a real change in attitude by the general public and our elected officials [/color]as many comments on the John Howard [EX AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER] knee jerk reaction back in 1996 where he organised the states to outlaw self loading rifles and pump action shotguns[because they looked bad in movies] totally condem his actions and comment after comment points out that outlawing guns only effectivly hurts honest citizens as the criminals are proving in western Sydney at the present time.
A very good example of prohibition and its causes and effect is when alcohol was outlawed in the United States in the 1920,s
Perhaps the tide may turn in the shooters and hunters favour, well! one can hope!


#2

When you say “Also many handguns come directly from Asia in the general mail as reported by police as our customs can only inspect about 3 to 5 per cent of entries into Australia”, you mean that Australia has no parcel scanning, like our airport baggage screening?


#3

They certainly have and the guns certainly will not come in parcels by mail.


#4

Canada scrapped its long gun registry on April 6, 2012 after 14 years and a 1000 times over budget cost.


#5

Hopefully more reasonable laws will result in an ease of ability for cartridge collectors to obtain, ship, and trade more cartridges whenever and wherever these gun laws are changed.


#6

I don’t know the speficic details but the glocks were imported by mail, the operaters of a southern Sydney post office branch and several others were charged, a large number of Glocks and parts were seized , the weapons were imported from Germany as parts in normal parcel post then reasembled for sale, the police suggest at least two hundred guns had been imported over time. There was some mention of shipping containers, not sure but surface mail may come in containers?and stated in the same news release was Australian ports customs could only inspect 3 to 5 per cent of the containers.
The police also suggested hand guns were comming in from Asia by mail, don’t know the detail but I am certain there would be people [criminals]in place to facilitate such methods. But I agree honest people without criminal support in the correct places could not get guns into Australia via general mail, But the police were not commenting on "Law Abiding Citizens"
Terry.


#7

Unfortunately there has been a knee jerk reaction. An Ammunition Control Bill has been discussed in the NSW Parliament. It would restrict ammunition sales to ONLY calibres of firearms registered to the buyer and they must provide the certificate of firearm registration to prove it.
Currently people can buy any ammunition that suits the category of licence they hold. So a person licenced for centre fire rifle could not buy auto pistol ammunition. however the new laws would only allow that person to buy (for example) 243 win ammunition for a rifle they own.

I am not sure how far this bill has progressed but it is not going to achieve any benefit and will simply hinder licenced firearms owners and gun shops while criminals will continue to access firearms and ammo illegally like they do currently.


#8

certain aspect of this post seem to repeat the world over. The original post could equally be true in Britain with drugs, guns, tobacco and people coming it unchecked. Gun control then kicks in with controls that only affect the legal user and don’t seem to touch the lawless. But hey we have tightened it up.

A couple of years back we came in from vacation in France (who then had much looser gun controls than here). we drove off the ferry at Portsmouth, through a sea of traffic cones before finding ourselves back on the road out. No customs, no immigration, nothing. What chance do we stand? i have done the same on occasions with friends at Dover (US citizens returning from the battlefields) who should at least have had to check in and out but nothing. its a joke


#9

Don’t be too happy about what the Govt might do! We here in South Australia are about to go through a Firearms Act upgrade, basically a Legislative action group was put together to smile & nod to the Police suggestions so that it could be said that consultation had taken place. Major stakeholders were left out (including ammunition collectors) of the process & all the submissions were conveniently lost, with the organisations involved having to put their submissions in again before a certain date!
One only has to look at what Australian Customs Service is doing to Warfare items when wanting to import. Cut 1/8th sections out of projectiles & fuses, grenades & mortar bombs, drill holes in cart. cases under 40mm. We all know as collectors that this stuff is just useless scrap metal that we put a historic value on, but someone out there doesn’t want us to own it! So who then is going to import into Australia, when the items have to be butchered? Other countries in Europe have tons of this stuff lying around live, but collectors in those countries don’t have to butcher items like we have to, it is a joke!
The media are only too happy to push the political agenda, rolling law abiding firearms owners & legally owned firearms into the illegal use stream. Hopefully the taxpayers of Australia won’t be sucked into forking out for another buy back that did nothing to stop the illegal use of illegally obtained firearms.
A bit off track I know but ammunition will be affected eventually, if we don’t stand up for ourselves!

Happy Collecting,

Ozzi.


#10

One good thing about the UK is that larger ordnance such as projectiles, fuzes and grenades have so far been left alone by the government. As long as they contain no explosives hey’re fine. I have read on the BOCN forum that in Germany the driving bands have to be cut on large projectiles, which of course completely ruins the item.


#11

Yeah, it is just gross vandalism to cut items like this up, for what? We all know they can’t be used as designed, they are no threat to community safety or national security if they are FFE (Free From Explosives). The badies will use any number of easily obtainable hardware items to make nasties out of, not purchase & import historic inert ammo.

In Australia all artillery guns in private ownership have to be rendered inoperable/incapable of firing a projectile, unless held on a license! So why the need to butcher the ammo as well?

We also know what is involved in the use of large ammo, propellant type & amounts needed, projectile fillings, fuse fillings, availability of quantity for proofing, all need to be in perfect working order and all out of the reach of any private individual!

We havn’t given up yet.

Regards Ozzi.


#12

In parts of Northern France there are piles of live shells lying by the roadside waiting to be collected. Nobody bothers with them. When the truck turns up to take them they are just thrown in the back. Quite a sight to see! Differing peceptions of risk. No shell (apart from being live) is a risk to society. Who has a 90 year old field gun sitting in their back yard?

Many of the shells sitting by the roadside have their driving bands and fuses removed by collectors. Now that is stupid, but I haven’t heard of any accidents.


#13

The bands and fuzes are more likely removed for scrap rather than by collectors.