AUTO PISTOL 6X22(not) WINCHESTER EXPERIMENTAL


#1

REPORTED AS WINCHESTER EXPERIMENTAL . 6X22 RIMLESS, NO HS, CN STEEL JKT. SHOWN HERE NEXT TO 32 AUTO AND 9MM LUGER


#2

new photo


#3

Does anyone else have one of these ?


#4

It would be interesting to see the head and base diameter of this round, as well as the actual, measured case length. The look of the base and primer is very much like the 8mm Nambu experimental (well, there’s that word again - can you really call an 8mm Nambu-caliber cartridge experimental, even if it was never made in quantity by the company and never offered for sale by them?) cartridge I have from Standard Cartridge Company, Pasadena, California, made not too long after WWII. They also made 9mm Para, with their first trials being with unheadstamped brass, culminating in a short-lived commercial offering with “SCC” headstamp. I have a selection of those rounds along with the commercial box, and the head looks similar to the Winchester (?) round again.

Is there any documentation of this round by Winchester, or what gun it was intended for?

I am just wondering if SCC fooled around with any other calibers besides 9mm Para and 8mm Nambu.


#5

No headstamp. I have sent this off for examination. More later.

As you might know auto pistol is not my area. The story came from the previous owner. I have sent this on to someone who should be better able to identify it.


#6

Any new information about this cartridge? You mentioned sending it to a friend who would know more about it.


#7

As soon as X-rays are done. I will publish the new info. Appears to have nothing to do with Winchester.


#8

I sent this to Woodin Lab for examination. After X-ray and study the only thing certain is that it is not Winchester.

I hope John Moss will have a chance to look this over in the near future.


#9

[quote=“CSAEOD”]I sent this to Woodin Lab for examination. After X-ray and study the only thing certain is that it is not Winchester.
…[/quote]

May be DWM 414…? A rare variant for Mauser C96…?


#10

The primer in this round as pictured appears to be a standard American-style small pistol primer with nickeled cup. I can’t be sure of the primer type, but no question it was nickeled. Other than the plated cups in dummies, I have never seen a pre-war DWM cartridge with a nickeled primer. If I am correct that the primer is boxer-type, it most certainly has nothing to do with DWM.

In reproductions of two different known copies of the original DWM case register, the 6mm Mauser pistol round is shown with no dimensions of any kind, simply the number and the name, and is marked “Veraltet” or "obsolete. " It doesn’t seem like the cartridge went anywhere. While Erlmeier-Brandt say that the cartridge was made in a small quantity, they were unable to provide any dimensions or even guess at the shape of the cartridge case, meaning that at least up until the time of publication of their book, they knew of no one who had ever seen this round.

If anyone does have a verified DWM 414 6mm Mauser cartridge, we all would sure love to see a picture of it. It most certainly COULD exist. It just doesn’t seem to have ever been encountered by anyone with an interest in ammunition.

Thanks for the thought though (I mean that sincerely). It was fun researching the Mauser 6mm, even though within my library, the search took me nowhere, it got me to looking at those great DWM case registers again, something I haven’t done in awhile. If only they could talk…!


#11

Woodin lab suggests that this case was made from a .223 rifle case.


#12

It looks from the photo like it has lathe marks on the head where a headstamp was turned off. Is that right?


#13

Possible.


#14

So this leaves the possibilies:

Experimental round
Someone’s wildcat
Cartridge of obscure calibre made for shooting
Joke/Fake made by someone


#15

Back where we started.


#16

Actually, we’re not really back to where we started. Thanks to you sending it to Woodin Lab for X-Ray, etc., we know its not a Winchester round. that’s information we didn’t have before.


#17

I am back where I started. I did not know what it was then or now and it looks like nobody else does either. All nondocumented identifications are conditional. Someone spent a lot of time and effort making this for purposes unknown.


#18

Hello !
Do you think this round is early (before WWII) or recent (afterWWII) ???
JP


#19

[quote=“jean-pierre”]Hello !
Do you think this round is early (before WWII) or recent (afterWWII) ???
JP[/quote]

It has been said that it is likely that it was made from a .223 Remington rifle case, which would put it in the 1960s or after.


#20

[quote=“Falcon”][quote=“jean-pierre”]Hello !
Do you think this round is early (before WWII) or recent (afterWWII) ???
JP[/quote]

It has been said that it is likely that it was made from a .223 Remington rifle case, which would put it in the 1960s or after.[/quote]

It was just a suggestion from Bill Woodin.
He din’t say it is 100 % sure.

CSAEOD, does it look old or new ?

JP