Black tipped 7.62 x 39


#1

I have a Tjechslovakian 7.62 x 39, grey lacquered case, blackened primer. The bullet jacket gmcs is almost complete (except 1 mm) black lacquered. Any idee’s what the use of this cartridge is? Thanks, Jan


#2

The Soviet color code for 7.62x39mm High Pressure Test is a nearly all black bullet tip color as you describe. Although I have not seen one of these from Czechoslovakia, I beleive they used the same color code and marking style of their HPT rounds as well. This is most likely what you have.

AKMS


#3

Thanks, AKMS, I was thinking in that direktion, it’s looks very well like the black tipped proof in 5.45 x 39, but also not Czechislvakian. There is also a well know proof in 7.62 x 39 of this country with the long cilyndrical projectiel, by forensic identified as a barrel proof, may be this one is a waepen proof?
May be our Chech , or East European friends know something for sure.
Wishes, Jan


#4

Here is a yugoslavia proof cartridge. Yugoslavia used the soviet color code too.


#5

Hello Rob, Yes i have this also in my collection, they have another one with an orange - red tip, they have a different function, I thought there is a differens in the % overpressure. The tip of my Czechoslovakian is much further black. We all think what it is, I will know what it is for real. Thanks, Jan


#6

Hi Jan,
yes you are right, black tip with black primer is high pressure type II - 3600 bar +/- 100 and the orange tip and primer are type I 3000 bar +/- 100.

regards
rob


#7

Question to both of you. What was the reason (need) to have ammo able to create different chamber pressure? How was that used?


#8

The long projectile “Barrel Test” is not the same as a “High Pressure Test”.
The barrel test was designed to fired into a medium so as to be recoverable. The recovered projectile was then measured to determine the actual land and groove diameters of the barrel. Sort of a hi-tech way of “slugging” the barrel. The high pressure test cartridge is used after the initial manufacture of a weapon or after a rebuild to test the strength of the action. It is my understanding that the first or lower pressure load is the “initial” or “first” proof and the second one is the “final” proof. Like the Yugo red/orange and black tipped loads, the Soviets have two HPT loads; marked with the long black tip and a long yellow tip. These are known in 7.62x39 and 5.45x39. Why the need for two proof stages, I do not know.

AKMS


#9

So, let me summarize your info to see if I get it correctly. You are saying that after final assembly each gun was tested with 2 rounds, first with low pressure,and then with high pressure and if nothing went wrong, the gun was approved for delivery. Correct? Are civilian (commercial) guns subjected to the same system?


#10

This is the cartridge.

Wishes,
Jan


#11

So, low pressure is a little bit black, and high pressure is entire thing black? Correct? Or am I getting confused?


#12

Great info AKMS, I wasn’t me aware of this funktion of the long bulletted proof.
sksvlad, the long bulletted proof doesn’t have a black tip at all, the cartridge with the almost complete black tip I show, we don’t know for sure what it is.
The Russians have two proofs one with a long black tip and one with a long yellow tip. As AKMS said in 5.45 x 39 and 7.62 x 39 ( the yellow one in 7.62 din’t cross my pad already)
Why two different proof rounds? Just what I think (and I’m easely wrong),Barrel proof coms first, as a barrel is of one piece it can have the highest pressure rater than a whole mechanisme of a complete weapen, so barrel test with the highest pressure round, complete weapen tested with a slightly lower pressure round. Where the place is of the long bulleted round (yes the Russians have one of them also “539 * * K”), in this picture I don’t know, probably as AKMS say finding out the caliber is right. Checking all this I find out I had another Czechslovakian black tipped one, here the bullet is 7mm not painted.
Thanks, Jan