CA Collectors


#1

I got this information second hand but it’s serious enough to pass on to collctors in CA who may want to check it out just to be on the safe side.

Supposedly, there was a shooter in LA (City or County, not sure) that was arrested for possesing some linked ammunition. In the situation that occurred the victim had his entire firearms collection seized and he was told charges are going to be filed because he had in his possession linked ammunition in quantities of more than 10 rounds of ammunition at a time. This has been interpreted as a violation of the “High Capacity Magazine” portion of the Assault Weapons Act in CA.

Again, this may be nothing more than Internet gossip but it’s certainly worth finding out.

Ray


#2

I cannot respond to this incident, since i am not familiar with it. However, it is clear that possession of ammunition linked in a quantity of more than ten rounds is a violation of the California High Capacity magazine law.

That said, I wonder how one would interpret the fact that a person has a quantity of rounds linked ten to a strip - that is, more than one ten-round belt of the same ammunition. Having multiples of legal, ten-round magazines for your pistol is not illegal in California. That is, you could have a 9mm Pistol for example, and legally have 6 or 7 10-shot magazines for it. So why not 6 or 7 ten-shot linked belts? Prosecuting for that, it would seem to me as a lay-person, would require a presumption of intent to eventually link the various ten-shot strips together; that is, a presumption of guilt. How does that square with the “presumption of innocence until proven guilty” axiom of most American law? Do we now prosecute people because we believe they MIGHT commit a crime?

Perhaps we have a criminal law attorney on this Forum who could answer this for us. Admittedly, I am applying common sense to California law, a virtually impossible task considering the mentality of those that make these laws in our State.


#3

Assuming the story is true, the unfortunate thing is that the guy had his property confiscated and it will likely remain confiscated for some time while the case winds it’s way thru the legal system. If then found innocent he will probably have one hell of a time getting everything back in good condition.

As to a presumption of innocence until proven guilty, that only applies in court. When a person is arrested and hauled away in hand-cuffs and his property confiscated, he is presumed guilty by the arresting officer. People are arrested quite often on a presumption of intent.

You’re right, we need an attorney/collector who can answer questions like this. Or at least give some guidance.

Ray


#4

Ray - you are right about a peace officer making an arrest on the presumption of guilt. Still, said officer must have probably cause to make such an arrest. Certainly, finding possession of a linked belt of ammunition with over ten rounds linked together could be probably cause if the party could not prove on the spot that he possessed it before it became illegal to possess. I don’t know why, again, that would be different from a box magazine, where possession of high capacity magazines acquired before they were illegal is not a crime (although later transferring them to someone else within the state is). Then, it goes to the District Attorney who has a moral duty to investigate probable cause, and see if it exists to the degree to warrant prosecution. Of course, this is often violated by politically-minded anti-gun DA’s, as well as ambitious ones eager to make any case that could promote their careers.

Most police officers apply these laws, even in California, with integrity and common sense, but there are always the few that don’t. The real blame is with the clueless politicians, that love a police-state atmosphere, that dominate the California legislature, not those who have to enforce these idiotic laws, and I admit that.


#5

Hi John,

just a little question:
You are retired, you can make a lot of money selling your house, and move to some very close states like Nevada or Arizona.

Why do you stay in california???
You are not masochist, aren’t you??

JP


#6

J-P - very easy. My wife won’t go since our family is here. I cannot throw away a 45-year marriage and impoverish both of us (as a split of resources would do) over the gun issue. I would love to return to America from the the Socialist Republic of California (Notice the red star on the California State flag? How prophetic those who designed it 150 years or so ago were), but it is not in the cards for me. I wonder how many people would grow out of the delayed adolescence stage of left-wing liberalism if they were forced to live in California?


#7

Story is true. Details here:

fiftycal.org/alerts/060922/


#8

Keith- Looks like that was September 2006. Any update on the outcome, or additional raids?


#9

There were other reports beyond this one. Don’t know any of the details myself. Owner’s got a long legal battle ahead of him.


#10
  • @ John Moss: You forgot to mention in your answer to “jean-pierre” that today in USA it is very hard to sell a house considering the disaster in the house market. Liviu 05/02/08

#11

Liviu - houses in my neighborhood, if priced properly for the current market (and anyone who has held his house for along time can do that and still make a hugh amount of money (if he diesn’t have to buy another house in Claifornia), sell in from three to ten days. If priced stupidly, by the insane, inflated prices of a year ago, then they are hard, perhaps impossible, to sell.

The agent in Reno, Nevada, just sold my sister-in-law’s home for us, by pricing it correctly (and it was no give-away) price, in the first three hours of the first day it was shown. The deal was totally finished and money in the bank in less than two weeks.

It is just like pricing cartridges - if people ask stupid prices, they don’t sell; if they price them fairly, to the existing market, the still sell well here, as far as I can see from our local market.