Can any ID this 22 Bullet in a Savage HP CTG Case


#1

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Cannot seem to find what this bullet was to be used for. Was loaded by a company in CA back in the 60’s I believe. Bill Woodin said the company did specialty loads. Anyone interested? I can send more pics.


#2

1SFG

Many of the bullets used in the 22 Hi-Power were two diameter like the one shown. They were usually .227 to .228 inch diameter and much heavier and longer than a regular 22 cal bullet used in the shorter cases and so they were made with two diameters to reduce pressure by reducing the suface engraved by the rifleing.

It may help if you’d describe the bullet in more detail. What is the jacket material? Is it a soft point? Diameters? Things like that.

To post two photos from Photobucket you need to use the “IMG” code in the drop-down, and post each one seperately.

Ray


#3

1SFG–I fixed up your first image again. As Ray said use the last choice in Photobucket and post each picture by it’s self.


#4

Thank for the help with the pics (I need it) but I’ll get the hang of it.
the 22 Savage Dimension of the Bullet are;

Total Length of bullet out of case: .865

Length of First step of bullet from mouth: .224

Dia at case mouth: 227

Body solid non magnetic, black metal
Hope this helps


#5

Bullet possibly made of aluminum, zinc, pewter, tin, lead, or somthing like that, and darkened??


#6

that is right … far as I can tell. It sure is a strange one…as I understand the 22 Savage was a pretty hot round for it’s time. It seems like a very long bullet considering the L/D of it. Just trying to figure if I should keep it or try to trade it off. I’m not collecting wild cats except the ones that have wound up with a military application/adoption. Maybe someone out there will want it to fill an empty slot in a drawer! hahahaha


#7

Apart from the jacket material it looks like a home swaging job. Using Corbin swaging equipment or similar.
Now my memory is straining a bit at this stage but around the timescale you are talking about there were a couple of hare brained schemes around (fads really). One was making .22 jacketed bullets out of fired .22 cases. The other was making your own jackets out of the then new aluminium coke and beer cans. I am sure others will remember them as well and possibly can remember who sold the equipment for making your own jackets.

Now that bullet is not made from a .22 case or an aluminium drink can but I think it sets a background to what was going on at the time. Maybe somebody ran a trial using sheet roofing zinc or something similar.

Ray, is that ring half way up the bullet the two diameter thing you were talking about or the join line from the swaging dies?

Vince


#8

I can’t help identifying this cartridge/bullet but I have an 8mm Mauser round that has a bullet that closely resembles the .22 round with the exception of not having a two-diameter form. The bullet material is also non-magnetic with what I think is a lead tip. Did Bill indicate the name of the company that made the specialty loads in California?


#9

Phil - I think I have several of these in my 7.9 collection. I had never seen one in a U.S. case until this thread.
I had thought they were some sort of European sporting bullet. I don’t know anything about the maker either.
Mine are like the one first shown on the thread. I wonder if yours is simply seated deeper? Perhaps not.

John Moss


#10

John
I thought about the seating of the bullet also. I know absolutely nothing about this cartridge!


#11

Vince

I don’t have the measurements of 1SFG’s bullet but it appears to be two diameter. The “line” would be where it changes diameters. As I said, this type of bullet was very common in the 22 Hi Power.

Using 22RF cases to make 22 bullet jackets was not a scheme or fad. During WWII they were about the only jackets that varmint shooters could find or buy. Several businesses got their start by making and selling them. RCBS and Speer for example. I have a pretty good collection of those bullets.

I cannot say that I’ve ever heard of making hi-velocity bullet jackets from aluminum coke or beer cans. I doubt if they would have held up under acceleration and would have fouled the bore.

Ray


#12

Some info I had on file from Bill Woodin: "odd bullet is typical of those made by Modern Gun Shop in CA. An Ad in Rifleman AUG 52 calls it MGS Bullet Co, Hollydale CA. The bullet is seated deep into the case. There is a slight line around the neck and above the shoulder, at that .030 depth. So Total Bullet length is 1.032//


#13

[quote=“RayMeketa”]Vince

I don’t have the measurements of 1SFG’s bullet but it appears to be two diameter. The “line” would be where it changes diameters. As I said, this type of bullet was very common in the 22 Hi Power.

Using 22RF cases to make 22 bullet jackets was not a scheme or fad. During WWII they were about the only jackets that varmint shooters could find or buy. Several businesses got their start by making and selling them. RCBS and Speer for example. I have a pretty good collection of those bullets.

I cannot say that I’ve ever heard of making hi-velocity bullet jackets from aluminum coke or beer cans. I doubt if they would have held up under acceleration and would have fouled the bore.

Ray[/quote]

Corbin on their website still list the .22 Rf jackets under “free .22 bullets”. To be fair the making of jackets from beer cans was in my memory limited to pistol bullets but it was one of those ideas that dropped from sight a couple of decades ago which suggests to me that like so many good ideas before it it never came to anything.
This bullet, whatever the jacket material turns out to be. I still maintain has all the hallmarks of a garage/ backstreet swaging operation by some enterprising soul in CA that never made it into the big time and has now disappeared back into the mists of cartridge history. The unsophisticated design nails it for me.


#14

Aha! Modern Gun Shop. MGS was one of those post war business that cashed in on the dearth of bullets in the late 40s and 1950s. They made custom bullets using copper tubing for the jackets, much like Fred Barnes did. Their calibers ranged from 22 all the way up to .375.

Vince - Did the guys who made bullet jackets from beer cans drink the beer first? that would explain a lot.

Ray


#15

Probably, such devotion to the cause is commendable. By the time you bought the beer and drank it it was no cheaper than buying proper jackets in the first place. Plus the cost of all the band aids cutting open the cans. What would you get? ten jackets from a can if you were lucky. You would end up in rehab before you got a good day at the range.


#16

OK all so should I keep this weird one or trash it as a “bad idea”??


#17

1SFG

It’s collectable, IMHO. Not winning the lottery but worth a couple of bucks to those who would collect cartridges from that era of innovation when shooters would do whatever was necessary to keep their rifles going.

Ray


#18

Thanks Ray … I have a lot of “stuff” and not enough knowledge about collecting! But I’m learning!!!