I read this story about UK police being allowed unannounced home inspections foxnews.com/world/2014/10/19 … s/@FoxNews. Are they also allowed to inspect ammo? Because usually two are linked together, especially in a target shooter inventory. Boy, I am happy we have a Bill of Rights in US, even though almost half of the US Supreme Court don’t believe it applies to regular Americans.
Yes, they can inspect anything allowed the citizen on his Firearms Certificate ‘FAC’. The have had that right for a number of years now, the new thing is that they can inspect on a mere suspicion and do not have to announce the visit beforehand.
The really stupid thing, included after the consultation period was over, is a crimestoppers telephone number where everybody can report their suspicions about gun (and ammo) owners. Already this has been dubbed the “Busybodies” number.
I guess Eric Blair (George Orwell) had his inspiration just outside his own front door…
In Germany, authorities responsible for issuing gun/explosives licences (it is not the police here) also have the right a make unannounced inspections, which they quite frequently do. They may even charge a fee for it.
The police can do whatever they like in reality because any sort of non co-operation would be viewed as incriminating. I would have thought that would be the same the world over.
Taking the Fox News report to task on a couple of points. Virtually no stolen guns in the UK actually end up being used for crime or terrorism. Stolen guns are nearly always high value shotguns stolen to order and exported for sale abroad. The threat of terrorism is a wonderful red herring that can be invoked whenever another anti gun measure is proposed. It cannot be countered with any rational argument but actually it is baloney.
The same porous borders that allow the shotguns to be exported illegally would allow terrorists to smuggle in a few guns without the need to steal them. The drug dealers and people trafficers don’t seem to have much trouble bringing drugs and people in.
With the water borders of UK, I suspect a lot of guns could be smuggled in, not a few. Look at the number of guns smuggled from various countries, including the USA (private sympathizers, I believe) into Ireland over the years.
In our own country, we no longer have a Southern Border to speak of - it is a wide-open door, retardless of the efforts of our over-worked, under-manned Border Patrol, that does their best under an administration that does not enforce the border, nor does it care. Our ocean borders on east and west are long, and out Coast Guard few. The Northern border has miles of wilderness to patrol - an impossible task, although the neighboring country being Canada likely discourages a lot of gun smuggling.
The bad guys will always be able to get weapons. In countries like Mexico that have stringent gun control laws inflicted on the innocents in their population, and as we have seen, on visitors as well, the criminals have more guns (and probably better ones) than the Army and National Police. There is no solid evidence that any gun law ever reduced crime, at least in our country. The States with the fewest firearms restrictions generally have the lowest crime rates overall. Of course, there are other social factors at play as well, and that is understood.
John, now we are part of the EU there are virtually no border controls. Take the ferry back from say France into Britain and you will most likely encounter no police, immigration or customs when you drive off the boat. Its classed as an internal crossing. There is more security on the Staten Island Ferry.
What gets my back up is that all this creeping legislation and control gets wafted in on the back of some mythical terrorist threat. Terrorism is the magic word that silences all opposition.
Don’t misunderstand me, the threat of terrorism is real enough here in London and we are all well aware of it.
What I don’t see is that a sixty year old man with a tray of assorted big game cartridges, all over a hundred years old, contributes much to that risk.
The other thing that worries me is these things get changed by rewriting ‘guidelines’ so it doesn’t go through the proper law making process.
A lot of anti gun and ammo stuff has crept through that way, so why have all the checks and balances of the British Parliament when people can lose their liberty on the basis of arbitrary guidelines that nobody has voted on?
This right to make unannounced inspections is because farmers in rural areas are known to be a bit lax in locking their guns up when not in use. Any other use of the power would be inappropriate.
[quote=“VinceGreen”]John, now we are part of the EU there are virtually no border controls. Take the ferry back from say France into Britain and you will most likely encounter no police, immigration or customs when you drive off the boat. Its classed as an internal crossing. There is more security on the Staten Island Ferry.
Vince, what our doogooding dictators forgot to say about the “EU without border controls” is that now anybody, any time in any place within the EU can be checked by customs - including your home.
So now they can come to anybody without good reason and just search his house as they wish - all totally legal of course.
Means also that when you have a normal police traffic control there is customs around who then will be allowed to search your car on the spot what regular police is not allowed to unless in a situ of “immediate danger” (what seldomly applies - too seldom it seems).
I wish we had our bordes and real money back and the EU gone!!!
In Italy police can inspect houses and collections in search of illegal guns or ammo without a warrant, since for drugs or guns related crimes a warrant isn’t needed for a police inspection.
It happened to me last year since, having received 2 empty cases via mail, police believed it was a threatening mail (in the same days several politicians and judges received bullets and cartridges by mail). They asked me why I received those cases and when I answered “I collect inert cartridges” they asked if they could take a look to the collection. They looked in my drawers and… they said that I should keep my collection hanged on the wall because it is very good and it is too bad that nobody can see it hidden into the drawers…
You guys make so much sense!!
The other creeping regulation is via stricter interpretations of existing laws. Nothing is changed except they start taking a harder line on certain grey areas in the laws. An example here in Aus are regulations that state a firearm can be classed as a higher “category” simply by its appearance. So a bolt action 22lr with a military looking stock can be classed as Category D, the same as semi automatic centrefires, simply because it is black and scary. Category D firearms are out of reach for 99% of firearms users here in Aus.
This regulation is starting to become one of the creeping regulations as it is up to a certain beurocrat to make the interpretation. Pistol grip stocks and even thumb hole stocks are potential victims as are any black coloured or camouflaged firearms. Anything used by the military or police can also be restricted in some states. So a WW2 Garand is illegal even if the person is licenced to own semi auto centrefires. The stupid part is that they can instead purchase and import a brand new AR15 style rifle, as long as it isn’t a “military” one (ie one of the many produced for the civilian market). That state police uses a Benelli shotgun for the tactical response unit so that model shotgun becomes illegal for civilian use too. !
Death by 1000 cuts!
If this thread wasn’t drifting away from ammo there is so much more I could say but I would like to extract the point about the insidious nature of creeping encroachment and tie it to the flagpole. I think that’s all.
Belgian police can control registrated owners of guns and ammunition at any moment between 5 am and 9 pm without warrant. These inspections can occur without announcement and give the right to inspect the weaponry of the owner and nothing more. In case of findings against the gun-act, all actions necessary can be taken, such as making police reports or seizures.