Cartridge of the Month - August


#1

Me again. Anxious as ever.


#2

Mentioning it might have given an appropriate occassion of linking it at the same time so people do not have to seach for it.


#3

EOD

It’s not there yet. That’s what Rick was saying.

No need for a search. It’s on the IAA Home Page.

Ray


#4

GIMME A BREAK!

Massive computer crash problems over last 2 weeks- got a new one with Vista—played with vista for a couple of days and then wiped that POS progam off the hard drive and started over with good old reliable XP. [No snickers from MAC/UNIX users please!].
Had August all done and will activate it now. I just plain forgot about it being time for this already. This month’s specimen and photos courtesy of H.J.T. Telkamp, and first mentioned on this forum.
http://cartridgecollectors.org/cmo/cmo07aug.htm


#5

These sectioned rounds are great but I am confused. There appear to be 2 shells one in brass and one in steel case. Are they both the same headstamp? There are also 2 differing types of self destroying capsules one appears to be steel or aluminum the other copper. How many were cut up to find 2 different ?


#6

John Moss is right. All I get is a blank page when using the side bar.

The cartridge this month is a really great one. I have a question. If there are only 9 known, does it mean that, since one was sectioned and one was fired, are there now only 7 left, or were there 11 before?

I believe there is a mistake in one of the captions. It says “St+” means a “steel case with a lacquered or plated finish”. Actually “St” means a “steel case with lacquered case”. The “+” means “with improved case” The improvement is believed to be a reinforced web in the head. Except for a few wrong headstamped cases the “St+” is not used on plated cases, except for a very few late war rounds.


#7

I think there are some problems with the title of this round.

It is shown as:

Spitzgeschoss mit Kern-Leuchtspur Verbessert (SmK Lsp Ub m Zerleger)

First of all it should be “stahlkern” not just “kern”. Second is the use of “Verbessert” (Improved) I don’t think this load was produced as a “Verbessert” loading. But if it was then, then a “-v” needs to be in the abbreviation. Also, in the abbreviation the "Lsp"s incorrect. It should be “L’spur”. Plus the term “Zerleger” should be part of the full name and the abbreviation should be “Z.” and “Ubungsmunition” needs to be added.

So, in my opinion it should read as follows:

Spitzgeschoss mit Stahlkern Ubungsmunition Leuchtspur mit Zerleger

S.m.K. Ub. L’spur m.Z.

If it is in fact a Verbessert load, which I doubt, the above should read

Spitzgeschoss mit Stahlkern Ubungsmunition Leuchtspur mit Zerleger-verbessert

S.m.K. Ub. L’spur m.Z.-v

And lastly, the English title should read:

7.92 x 57 mm Mauser Practice Tracer with Self Destruct

or

7.92 x 57 mm Mauser Practice Tracer with Self Destruct-Improved


#8

[quote=“Ron Merchant”]I think there are some problems with the title of this round.

It is shown as:

Spitzgeschoss mit Kern-Leuchtspur Verbessert (SmK Lsp Ub m Zerleger)

First of all it should be “stahlkern” not just “kern”. Second is the use of “Verbessert” (Improved) I don’t think this load was produced as a “Verbessert” loading. But if it was then, then a “-v” needs to be in the abbreviation. Also, in the abbreviation the "Lsp"s incorrect. It should be “L’spur”. Plus the term “Zerleger” should be part of the full name and the abbreviation should be “Z.” and “Ubungsmunition” needs to be added.

So, in my opinion it should read as follows:

Spitzgeschoss mit Stahlkern Ubungsmunition Leuchtspur mit Zerleger

S.m.K. Ub. L’spur m.Z.

If it is in fact a Verbessert load, which I doubt, the above should read

Spitzgeschoss mit Stahlkern Ubungsmunition Leuchtspur mit Zerleger-verbessert

S.m.K. Ub. L’spur m.Z.-v

And lastly, the English title should read:

7.92 x 57 mm Mauser Practice Tracer with Self Destruct

or

7.92 x 57 mm Mauser Practice Tracer with Self Destruct-Improved[/quote]

Ron,

The box label from this round say.

7.9 SmK Patr. L` spur


#9

WOW…thanks for wetting the appetite…I now have a new color tipped special purpose round on my number one hit list (after having landed the '06 frangible tracer) ! (anyone know where there is a box full !!!)


#10

Dutch–I can accept that abbreviation. The box label also makes it clear that this is NOT a Verbessant load, as I suspected.


#11

[quote=“Dutch”][quote=“Ron Merchant”]I think there are some problems with the title of this round.

It is shown as:

Spitzgeschoss mit Kern-Leuchtspur Verbessert (SmK Lsp Ub m Zerleger)

First of all it should be “stahlkern” not just “kern”. Second is the use of “Verbessert” (Improved) I don’t think this load was produced as a “Verbessert” loading. But if it was then, then a “-v” needs to be in the abbreviation. Also, in the abbreviation the "Lsp"s incorrect. It should be “L’spur”. Plus the term “Zerleger” should be part of the full name and the abbreviation should be “Z.” and “Ubungsmunition” needs to be added.

So, in my opinion it should read as follows:

Spitzgeschoss mit Stahlkern Ubungsmunition Leuchtspur mit Zerleger

S.m.K. Ub. L’spur m.Z.

If it is in fact a Verbessert load, which I doubt, the above should read

Spitzgeschoss mit Stahlkern Ubungsmunition Leuchtspur mit Zerleger-verbessert

S.m.K. Ub. L’spur m.Z.-v

And lastly, the English title should read:

7.92 x 57 mm Mauser Practice Tracer with Self Destruct

or

7.92 x 57 mm Mauser Practice Tracer with Self Destruct-Improved[/quote][/quote]

Ron,

The box label from this round say.

7.9 SmK Patr. L` spur


#12

It was a training round used by ground troops. That


#13

Yes, that is all true, and all reasons that I said the round could not be a Verbessant round as stated on the “Cartridge of the Month” title.


#14

Absolutely correct.


#15

If memory serves, the sectioned ones came from German display cards. No cartridges were harmed in the preparation of this web page.


#16

There were 10 steel cased rounds found in the Netherlands.
A fellow collector phoned me and told me what he had found. I could not believe that, and I told him it must be tracer rounds with a longer black tip. Nobody had ever seen one before. He asked me how he could find out if they were original, I told him to pull of one bullet and put a flame on the tracer. If the thing was exploding it was original. It was mend as a joke. Later he told me the bullet was exploded in a cigar box and now there were 9 left.
The parts you see at the IAA page were the leftovers from this experiment.

The bullets used in the cuts all come from a pool by DWM L


#17

OK, I stand corrected. However, I have seen examples that came from the display cards.


#18

Why is there a hardened steel core in a practice cartridge? Seems like a waste of time and material to me…

AKMS


#19

At least one source reports a self destroying ball round as well as the self destroying APT. So far none have been seen by reporting collectors. An APT has to have an AP core. The initial idea was that the AA fire falling in occupied territory would do less damage if the projectile was destabilized in this manner. It makes sense. It doesn’t seem that much of this was made.

I think the litter from 88 and 120mm AA guns was a much greater problem than the 7.9s. Even exploded these things rain down some heavy pieces.

That makes the 7.9 issue seem pretty small.


#20

Kids in England during WW2 used to collect these pieces. British AA shell fuses were apparently prized finds, as well as German incendiary bomb tailfins (although these came off when the bomb hit the ground). Some kids apparently found live incendiaries, and took them apart to get the thermite out, but this all ended once the Germans put an explosive anti handling charge in them, apparently a few were killed.