"conus" cartridges


#1

I heard about these cartridges or loadings, but I can’t understand what is a “conus”

It is probably a German word but I wasn’t able to find out a translation in my dictionaries


#2

One meaning of CONUS is “Continental United States.”

This was sometimes used to designate ammunition intended for use only within the continental United States for training purposes, not for transport “OUTCONUS” or outside the contintental United States to combat zones. Probably this involved ammunition lots that were not fully up to standards, or that packaging was not the type specified for extended shipment or storage.

There may be other meanings.


#3

The “Continental United States” meaning has nothing to do with these cartridges. I think the term is Austrian, but could be wrong. I don’t recall ever seeing a real definition of what the word means. My understanding of the cartridges is that they are uusually solid brass rounds that are formed in such a way that a replaceable (reloadable) lead bullet can be snapped over a projection at the front of the cartridge, and a special primer used for repriming, to create a short-range, reusable training cartridge. Perhaps I have over-simplified that description though. I had some of these from Czechoslovakia (Sellier & Bellot) from the 1920s in 7.9 x 57 Vz 24 caliber. At least I think they were from the 1920s, but I amy be mixing up the possible manufacturer with the “vz 24” which was on at least one of the headstamps, perhaps two. I also have an unheadstamped one, obviously Czech as well.


#4

What John has said is fairly close. In Austria, I believe that these are called ‘Konus’ and are just chamber adaptor’s utilising a blank cartridge and a cap acting as a replaceable bullet.

Several types are known but typical examples are shown at http://municion.org/ for the 8x50R Mannlicher.


#5

Thanks!


#6

@WBD

Could it be we speak about Zielmunition/Zielpatrone.


Rgds
Dutch


#7

In 1902 Austro-Hungary adopted training device Kapselschießeinrichtung M.2 also named Ladekonus for indoor practice shooting with Mannlicher rifles and carbines. This device consisted of massive brass “cartridge” with lengthwise hole named 8 mm M.2 Ladekonus, special primer 8 mm M.2 Kapseln with small load of black powder and lead bullet 8 mm M.2 Bleigeschosse.


#8

So the two 6.5 carcano short range models can be considered “conus” cartridges.

The early model is a solid brass and steel cartridge loaded with a special primer and a little lead bullet at the top and it was reloadable. The later type had a standard primed case with a fake bullet and light charge of powder, loaded with the same lead bullet


#9

Dutch, thanks for showing that Zielpatrone (“Target cartridge”) - I had not seen that before.

I assume this is the German equivalent of the the Austrian 'Ladekonus for indoor practice shooting ’ (Thanks Treshkin for the details also). It certainly looks like it has the same construction.

I assume it to be 8x57 JS ?? Would like to hear any details ?? Manufacturer, symbol on hs ?

Is ‘ZIELMUNITION’ possibly being used as a trade Mark or Brandname ?

I know of similar adaptors in:

8.15x46R c1897-1904 by HP
6.5x52 Carcano (it is the same construction Pivi)
6.5x54 MS
as well as
8x50R Mannlicher
Must be others also …


#10

11 mm Mauser (german patent)
11 mm gras (Berthier, France
7.65 Belgian (Berthier)
11 mm Swedish (french patent)
30-40 Krag and 12.7 Remington by King & Bell (Us patent)
8 Lebel (Cartoucheries Russo Belges, Belgian)
11 mm Gras (Leblanc, France) and krag Jorgensen and 3036 (Nandrup, Sweden)
11 mm Gras (Geydon, France)
11 Gras (gaupillat, France)
8 Lebel (SFM)
8 Mle 92 (SFM)
Swiss Vetterli Rifle (SFM)
and so on


#11

I do not know the maker of the Zielmunition 07, but can confirm that it was a production item, as I had one in my 7.9 collection as well, although only the adaptor, not loaded wither with primer or projectile.

I suspect that the little three-position mark on the headstamp may represent the manufacturer, but I personally cannot identify it.


#12

[quote=“JohnMoss”]I do not know the maker of the Zielmunition 07, but can confirm that it was a production item, as I had one in my 7.9 collection as well, although only the adaptor, not loaded wither with primer or projectile.

I suspect that the little three-position mark on the headstamp may represent the manufacturer, but I personally cannot identify it.[/quote]

John, I am almost sure, it is AEG Berlin.

You find this 3 position mark also on 32 round 08 magazines and on an Ex 7,9 Mauser.

BTW an other head stamp of this kind of round.

Rgds
Dutch


#13

Dutch - Wow, what a great headstamp. What do the abbreviations stand for, “Deutsche Abteilung?” Did Hirtenberg have a German Office at this level?