DAG 85 9x19 training round (blank)



I’m a bit puzzled by this little 9x19 training round (blank firing round) which was found by my little nephew in the nearby forest, a former training grounds for the Dutch military, and given to me.

The round has probably spent quite some time out there, could be at least 20 years. I know these in brass very well, having shot them in my service Uzi and having a number of these training rounds in my collection as well. Head stamp on this one is DAG 85, so a Dynamit Nobel AG round from 1985.

The case material is somewhat deteriorated due to the time it spent out there, but I can’t seem to identify what it is? It certainly isn’t regular brass and the case is non-magnetic. Tried some delicate cleaning but it rubs off in a brown rust-like color.

Any suggestions?


Here is a side-by-side comparison of the DAG 85 round, compared to a ‘normal’ Dutch military training round. Note the case material and the inverted DAG head stamp, as well as the primer crimps.


I suspect that the case is brass. I have samples of this round, down to the Nickel primer in dates 80-86 (except for 84) and all are brass case. I have only ever seen this cartridge with brass cases.





I measured the round on a jewelers scale and it weights as much as the brass one, which seems to indicate that both are made of the same material.

If it is, or rather ‘was’ brass, it is the weirdest type of surface corrision I have seen to date. I have seen, handled and cleaned stuff that has spent 90+ years on the seabed, in the ground, in old deteriorated packaging, etc…

Brass, especially German brass, is usually pretty rugged. But then again, the area in which it was found is very poor (bad) soil, useless for agriculture. They planted pine woods there because these trees were about the only plants that would grow (production forests for a now disappeared mining heritage). Perhaps the acidic nature of the soil produced this result?


Vlim, I have no insight into why it should age like it did. Perhaps there is a high salt content in the soil???



Just filed away a small bit on the top of the case, the material is brass underneath.

Let’s leave it to the extremely acidic nature of the soil in which the round has been laying for some 20 years.