Designs 8x60R M1885 Guedes, 8x60R M1886 Kropatschek

Looking for G.Roth designs, for supply with Steyr Rifle Contract to Portugal
I know the Guedes order was substituted by the Kropatschek, and remaining Rifles and ammo went to Boer Republics in 1899.
I have both a Guedes ( bringback from Boer War) and Portuguese Kropatscheks ( 1889 Mfg date).
As we make Krop. “8×56R” (1899) cases, would like to know dimensions for original 60R case.

SFM or GR/ K&C drawings TIA
Doc AV

Hi, some SFM draws

Bsrg, Dan


Hi Forget,
Inerte SFM vs F&C

Bsrg, Dan


Who is F&C, as a supplier? PORTUGUESE OR foreign??
Thanks Doc AV

I have F & C, as POSSIBLY, MAYBE, being Fusnot & Cie, Belgium.


Hi, some F&C are found/see in the Boers Battlefield zone, one author speak about somewhere see it in south Africa, look Vidar Article in IAA 450 page 6.
No sure for nothing about the Hstp F&C “unknow”, Fusnot is perhaps a good idéa,
Bsrg, Dan

What were the original cartridges loaded with, black or an early smokeless? Were the cartridges sent to the Boers smokeless?

The best source for info on Boer ammo is "Rifles and Carbines of the Anglo Boer War " Bester
It appears that the Guedes ammo in Boer use was both black and smokeless.