DWM 9mm paperweight?


#1

I stumbled over this interesting paperweight for sale on Ebay, and was wondering of anyone could tell me if this was actually made by DWM, and if so roughly when.

http ://www.ebay.com/itm/Paperweight-D-W-M-9MM-Luger-Bullet-Shaped-WWI-or-WWII-NR-/201044583936?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ecf30e600


#2

Without measurements, especially of the head and base, it is hard to tell. The ruler is some help, but for me, not much. I have a very similar “cartridge.” Knowing my love for 9 mm Para stuff, a friend of mine made it for me as a joke, using a cut down .50 Browning MG cartridge (HENCE THE IMPORTANCE OF HEAD AND BASE MEASUREMENTS), and a solid copper truncated bullet he turn out on his Unimat lathe. It is very good - easily as nicely done as the one in the picture.

Did the one you show have a headstamp? I did not look at the eBay listing. From DWM at any time when they were making 9 mm and with a truncated bullet, I would have expected something a little fancier - perhaps with a DWM Banner on it, or on a wood base with a DWM ID plate, as such an item, if made at a factory like DWM, would likely be for an executive’s desk or as an advertising item.


#3

The headstamp shown with the listing is:

at the auction here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Paperweight-D-W-M-9MM-Luger-Bullet-Shaped-WWI-or-WWII-NR-/201044583936?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ecf30e600

The seller’s description says he doesn’t know exactly how old it is, but presumes it is pre-war. He gives an OAL of 95.25mm and a diameter of 28.6mm. He says the case length is 57.2mm


#4

In my opinion, this is phony. I do not see DWM using the designation “9 mm LUGER” on even a paperweight, made before WWII. The headstamping does not appear to be up to their peacetime quality, as well.

My friend was going to headstamp the big one he made for me, but he tried the bullet for fit first, and then couldn’t get it out of the case. Evidently, he needed to put a mandrel in the case in order to strike a good headstamp by hand, a letter at a time. It was going to be “John Moss 9 mm.” So, he simply finished it up unheadstamped.


#5

And correct me if I am wrong but the “M/M” is no German writing at all.


#6

John, I wouldn’t call it a “phony” but definitely not a product of DWM. Instead it is a bit of whimsy.

I suspect the maker had an old truncated Winchester 9mm Luger and made this paperweight. At 3.75 inches long it is bigger than similar items I have seen. The bullet shape is closer to the old Winchester bullets than the DWM bullets and a Winchester model would also explain the “9M/M LUGER”. Finally, I do not recall any DWM headstamp using “D.W.M.” but the DWM experts know lots more about that than I do.

Like much else on eBay, the item was likely made in good faith, but the seller’s description is a bit misleading!

Hope the new owner is pleased with it!

Cheers,
Lew


#7

In my opinion, the minute the DWM initials were used on the headstamp, it became a “fake.” It matters not what the original intent of making it was. When it is sold as a DWM item, or even as a “possible” DWM item, that definitely takes it into the realm of fakes, no matter who the seller is.

The one my friend made for me was to have my name and date of birth as the headstamp. When he tried the bullet for fit, and could not extract it again, the headstamp went out the window as he needed to put something down inside the case in order to be able to properly stamp the letters on the head. It has no headstamp. Since it has no identity as to a maker, it would only be a “fake” if I tried to represent it as something other than what it is, or if I had otherwise fake markings applied somewhere on the item. As it stands the way he made it, I consider a cute novely item for a 9 mm fan.

That’s simply my take on the question, and I stand by it.


#8

John, Had the seller claimed it was made by DWM than that is one thing. He could have been lying or he could have just been making an error which most of us do with regularity.

This guy was clever. In fact, what he said was:

And then he quoted wikipedia on DWM! A very clever way of leaving an impression that is false with two true statements.

Cheers,
Lew


#9

Although not related with this artifact, the DWM factory at Karlsruhe advertised lampstands, ashtrays and cigar cutters made from projectile shells, artillery cases, and cartridges. Does anyone have one of these? I wonder how to distinguish one of these original objects from the rest of the handicrafts commonly found.


#10

Lew, precisely why I called this a fake. Many of us make errors - the sale of something like this purposefully giving the impression that it is from an official source of one kind or another is a fake. There is simply nothing else you could call it with any accuracy.


#11

John,
I will bring it to St. Louis so you can see it. I liked it because I have a collection of scaled up (or down) cartridges.
Bruce


#12

Bruce - Unfortunately, I cannot be at St. Louis. Frankly, if I saw that item at a gun or cartidge show, at a reasonable price, I would buy it myself knowing it is a fake. I hope no one confuses my opinion of it as being of the idea that I don’t think anyone should want it or like it. I, too, like oversize and miniature cartridges, and am fortunate enough to have even a few from the Swiss Master, Mr. Crottet, in my collection. In fact, I did not let my three 7.9 x 57 (Actually 4 x 28.5 mm) minatures, with miniature stripper clip and two miniature boxes, go when I divested myself of my 7.9 collection. As long as one is aware of the fact that a round is not what some would claim, and willing to pay the price to obtain it, for whatever personal reason, I don’t see how anyone can have any particular problem with that. Woodin Laboratory has a collection of fake rounds, kept for reference, and I find it one of the more fascinating aspects of the collection. One day I will photograph my miniatures - not a world-class collection by any means but perhaps interesting anyway - and put the photo the forum, along with another photo of the few double-size rounds I have. I consider none of those to be fakes, as they were either “purpose-driven” rounds made for presentation, and represented to be exactly what they are by the manufacturer, or they were made by a friend of mine for my personal use and with the knowledge that he made them; that is, that they were not acquired from some outside source. No matter, as I said, given the opportunity under the conditions previously stated, I would have acquired the fake “DWM” oversize 9 mm for my own collection.