Eley 12 bore Lethal Ball

In a previous thread , l had found out from some helpful forum members here that until 1956 , Eley Brothers had listed a 12 bore Lethal Ball cartridge in their price list . I know that the Lethal Ball cartridges were made by Eley in both 2 1/2 inch shell length and 2 3/4 inch shell length .
However , if anyone here has a copy of a 1950s Eley catalog , could you please tell me if the 12 bore lethal ball cartridge is listed in a 2 3/4 inch shell length ?
Really appreciate it.
Buck

Oh , come on . Someone must know

Hey, posted on a weekend day, give people time to get to their computers!!

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Struggling to log onto the site again.

No record of it in what catalogues I can get to for that date era.

Just out of interest it was available in 3" cases in earlier catalogues.

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Eight Bore
What about the 1952 catalog which you had posted a snippet of ?

Nope, I would have said if it was.

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Okay , so final confirmation . Initially the Eley Lethal Ball cartridges were made in 2 1/2 inch , 2 3 /4 inch , and 3 inch lengths ? However , by 1952 , they were only made in 2 1/2 inch length until they completely disappeared by 1957.
Is that a correct conclusion , Eight Bore ?
Thank you for your pain staking trouble . I am indebted.

Do you know when the 3 inch case stopped getting listed , Eight Bore ?

Buck,
There were no Eley Brothers catalogs at that late date, by this time they were Eley-Kynoch - ICI.
I do not have a 1956 catalog but I attach a scan of a page from the 1957 Eley-Kynoch catalog. not very helpful as you can see very scant details and no case lengths.
Jim!

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I really appreciate the help. Do you have any Eley catalogs which list the lethal ball round and mention any case lengths at all ?
I saw a snippet of the 1952 catalog provided by Eight Bore which shows that Lethal Ball was available only in the 2 1 /2 inch length .
However , l was told that earlier catalogues listed the lethal ball loads in 3 inch and 2 3/4 inch lengths as well .
I know that by 1957 , no Lethal Ball cartridges of any length were being sold by Eley at all !
I just want to know when the 3 inch and 2 3/4 inch Lethal Ball cartridges stopped being sold .

I think Eight Bore gave the right answer. So
In earlier catalogs , lethal ball cartridges were available in 3 inch length and 2 3/4 inch length. However , from 1952 to 1956 , Lethal Ball cartridges were only made in 2 1 /2 inch length until all lethal ball cartridges got discontinued in 1957.

Buck,
I dont have many E-K.

catalogs of this later period, but I attach here a page from the 1939 Eley-Kynoch catalog.
Note at the bottom “*Special Loading - for all qualities of shotgun cartridges”, so in theory you could get any of the above lengths in 1939.
Jim

Buck,

And here is more - not much help as it does not specify case lengths.
This is from the 1936 Export catalog.

Jim

Buck,

another piece from the 1935 catalog - nothing new for you perhaps but may be of interest to those others not aware of what balls we are discussing.

Jim

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Thank you Jim for the painstaking trouble you took for me .
So , in the 1930s , you could get Lethal Ball cartridges in 2 1/2 , 2 3/4 and 3 inch shell length.
From 1950 onwards , Lethal Ball could only be had in 2 1/2 inch shells.
Then in 1956 , Lethal Ball cartridges were listed for the last time before disappearing completely.

Buck,

Further to the pictures in the other topic on lethal ball, the following scan is from page 27 of the 1935 showing that any case from the list can be supplied loaded with lethal bullet or the Kynoch destructor bullet.

This is for the bores sizes quoted i.e. 12, 16 & 20 only, however all lengths of these cases are listed. This infers a 2 1/2", 2 3/4" & 3" were available in 1935

As to the statement they disappeared completely, I am not 100% certain of that as I have no catalogues from the date range needed to prove that! I believe they probably were available until the end of the ICI era (circa 1962) although maybe not advertised. I can certainly remember them being about as a teenager but that could just have been old stock.

@ArmourerJim
Jim, do you remember them?

Mike.

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@Eightbore l really appreciate it .
One last question. In your 1952 catalog which you had shown me a snippet of , only the 2 1/2 inch length shell is listed for lethal ball , right ?

Mike,

Yes, I do remember them ! I have shot a few when I was a kid, but as you say they may have been old stock !!! I was not a collector in those days. (Sixty years ago).
Also I do not have any later catalogs.

Jim

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@ArmourerJim were the lethal ball loads any good for hunting big game ?

Buck,

Personaly I never had the chance at large game with these, but I guess they would be OK at short range for soft skinned game.
That is what they were intended for, and I have heard tales of them being used succesfuly for such in India and Africa.
Most of these went to the old British colonies as there was/is nothing on four legs walking in this little island that requires such a load.
Today these are not legaly allowed for the casual shotgunner or even collector they are classed as section one ammo, and require a firearms certificate from the police, just to possess .

Jim

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Buck,

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