Googlemunition -success!


#1

I googled “ammunition” and it took 9 pages to get to this (IAA) site. This site should come up first-although it is hard to beat out wikipedia.

Come on computer guys what do we do to get on the first page above the fold?


#2

Content, content, content, is the primary way to be top ranked with any keyword on google. The bigger the site is (the more pages), the better it is ranked. This combined with lots of activity and a constantly changing homepage is what Google algorithms look for. If the Journals were upload and properly indexed (page by page & LOTS of work) to the site, the IAA would be number one for almost any ammo related keyword combo. Typically, only the massive sites, with thousands of “source coded”, pages get priority ranking with the search engines. It also depends how many other web sites also have the same combination of key words in their content. This ammunition forum really helps to add content. On top of this, single keywords are extremely difficult to capture high ranking on. For example, you would have better luck finding this ammunition forum by typing in, “Anti-Aircraft Ammunition”, vs “Ammunition”, or another multi word search. At one time we were #1, page one for “White Tiger” for over 4,000,000 web sites containing the keyword combo “White Tiger”. If you typed in “tiger” we were 33 pages from the top. Anyhow, with time and content growth, this forum will be constantly better ranked. ASt least I think :-) I’m no computer expert, but this is what I have learned for writing content for our site.


#3

Sorry it is false.

Check on google for shotshells for example.
You will find my site first and far away before oldammo and others websites, despite the fact it small and updated only twice a year.

The trick is not what is inside, nor how many times you change it, but in the keywords you put in the first page.
JP


#4

Sorry it is false.

Check on google for shotshells for example.
You will find my site first and far away before oldammo and others websites, despite the fact it small and updated only twice a year.

The trick is not what is inside, nor how many times you change it, but in the keywords you put in the first page.
JP[/quote]

What do you suggest?


#5

I googled “shotshells” . The IAA site came up #6 on the first page. How do we do that for 'ammunition" ?

We are not getting help from the NRA. We need to do this ourselves.

There are MILLIONS OF NRA members ALL OF WHOM USE AMMUNITION but only 1000 IAA members.

DOES ANYONE ELSE SEE A PROBLEM OR OPPORTUNITY IN THAT ?


#6

It might help to re-work some of the keywords the web site uses. While keywords aren’t as important for page rankings as they used to be, it is a good practice to use a limited number of keywords that are specific to the site. If you have too many keywords the search engines will think you are engaging in “keyword stuffing”, which is the practice of listing lots of irrelevant keywords simply to drive more traffic to your site.

Looking at the keywords on the home page, some of the terms listed are:

cartridge
collector
history
preservation
legislation
1911
etc…

It might help to eliminate some of these and make others more specific (i.e. change “history” to “ammunition history”, “collector” to “cartridge collector”, etc.).

It is also useful to include the most relevant keywords for the site in the meta description tag and in the title tag. Sorry for the techno babble, but the folks who run the site will know where these are. (The description tag looks pretty good already.)

Since less-reputable sites (porn, spammers) try to unfairly manipulate search results in order to drive as much traffic to their sites as possible, search sites are forced to be secretive about the exact methods they use to rank pages. They also rely on parameters that are not in the control of a site’s owner; one example is the number of pages that link to your site.

I know that it’s always a struggle for me to optimize the search rankings for the sites I administer. It seems more like a black art than a science!


#7

Ammunition is a black art and we need more of it on the electronic level. How about hocus and pochusing up some super nonporno electron traps you black magic electromagicians? Anyone putting in the word ammunition in the googlemachine should get the IAA front and center.

Is it possible to tie into wikipedia? They seen to get the first spots regularly.

Our porno,magic cure and investment spam seems to be at an all time low. You guys must be doing something right.


#8

From what I have learned it has always been key words, quality source coding of pages, an actively changing home page and lots of content. Our site is getting about 150,000 visits a week. It also depends on the volume of other sites and how they are coded and with what key words. Anyhow, I’ll leave this to others with more computer / internet savvy. We have a full time volunteer who does nothing but optimize the site for search engine ranking. Allot of this is the way each page is source coded. We also adapt this coding periodically as algorithms change. In the end, I’m more of a hands on animal handler then web site guru, this is just what I have learned from our experiences. Every site is different as is the number of keyword competition. We have also noticed a drastic jump in keyword ranking when multiple relevant photos were added to relevant pages. The photos had matching keywords and were also coded to match the content subject matter. I’m done Nerding :-)


#9

Getting links on Wikipedia is a very good idea. It is my understanding that search engines give more weight to links from sites that are considered authoritative. Thus a link from Wikipedia would get more points than a link from “Chip Orr’s Cartridge Barn”.

Are there any Wikipedia gurus out there who could identify a few relevant ammunition articles and get a link to the IAA listed with the article?


#10

There are guys flying this site who can edit my posts before I get back to see how they look. So, I know someone has the ability to link this up with the big time players.

We have already gone public. Too late to hide now. Real men have always known; AMMUNITION- GOOD , NO AMMUNITION-BAD.


#11

AAAAARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!


#12

Thank you for posting in English.


#13

Glad someone noticed the drastic drop in spam (as in none or very little). It is not because we get spammed less, you guys just don’t get the pleasure of seeing it. We have gone to a veted registration process. Before a new person can post on the Forum now, they must pass the scrutiny of the Admin. and Moderators. who must grant permission to complete their registration. We still get about 15 spammers per day, but we kill them before you all see them. More work for us, but more pleasure for you.


#14

It is very noticible! Thanks Ron, I know it is alot of work on your end. Spamers are getting very creative, especially overseas targeting us. You guys do a great job, I know it is not easy. Thank you all so much.


#15

Google ranking is outside my skill set, but many good ideas have been thrown out in the discussion above. Here’s my recommendations:
(a) Someone volunteer to take on the task of updating Wikipedia entries related to ammo and linking to something relevent on the IAA site. Terms in the glossary are an obvious choice, as are the several “Intro for collectors…” on .30-06, shotshells, artillery, etc. A generic Wiki addition along the lines of "Further history and technical informaiton on [this topic] may be available from experts at the International Ammunition Association forum at iaaforum.org/forum2/index.php"
You don’t need to do this all in the next 24 hours, but maybe 20 entired in the next 30 days is easy enough.
Anyone? ANYONE???

(b) I would like at least five people to post a list of the words /phrases that they think are most relvant to ammunition collecting. Break these into three sections- Top 5, top 12, top 25. I will see about getting some form of these adopted for the tags/title/description type stuff that Chip Orr mentioned. (Or, I would be delighted to have Chip take this project on since he really knows more about web stuff and ammo than I do!)
Please jsut post them on this thread. Feel free to steal terms from other people’s lists if you like, just rank them how you think they are most important.


#16

Here are a few keywords/phrases that come to mind:

ammunition
ammunition identification
ammunition collecting
cartridge collecting
ammunition history

I’m certainly not an expert at search ranking optimization - I struggle with it on my own sites! I do think that with input from a few different people we can get a good list going.

It might be helpful to see what search terms people are currently using to get to the site. If the web server keeps a referrer log it should contain this information. I’d be happy to take a look at the logs if someone wants to send them to me (my email address is in my profile).


#17

You guys are doing a great job with that. Here I am thinking that all you do is chase me around editing my posts but you are actually riding the fences too.

It seems like many of the Europeans from various countries stopped visiting when they had to register. There were many more Poles and Finns earlier.


#18

You guys are doing a great job with that. Here I am thinking that all you do is chase me around editing my posts but you are actually riding the fences too.

It seems like many of the Europeans from various countries stopped visiting when they had to register. There were many more Poles and Finns earlier.[/quote]

Actually spend far more time patrolling the perimeter than monitoring the action in the forums.

If someone is put off by registering / being vetted, they are living a sheltered life. This is pretty much SOP across the Net these days except on sites which are completely innundated with spam (which is the reason for the infestation).

Excellent suggestion, CSAEOD! The topics of search engines and Wikipedia were things we touched on a few times in staff discussions over the last year. As the webmaster’s post suggests, it is a matter of time and expertise. The word imbedding have to be discussed within the staff - I sure do not have the expertise (nor the access) to address it.

There are close to a dozen projects on the “To do” list, but all staff are volunteers with other commitments and few with the requisite skill set, so it WILL take time to implement all of it.
.


#19

CSAEOD–I have no idea why the Europeans and Finn’s seem to have left us. But it wasn’t because of the new Veted policy. That only applies to NEW people registrating. All those on-line before the new policy remained without being veted. And, no, even through you might feel picked on, you are not the ONLY one.


#20

Participation is cut drastically by a registration requirement. Another site I run had forums on several gun maker topics, and when we switched to registration required to post, the number of valid posts dropped by about 50-75%.
However, without requiring registration the only other viable option would have been to shut them down entirely, or devote several hours every day to deleting spam (on the order of 20-60 spam posts per per day on each of the forums).

I fought requiring registration for the IAA forum for a long time, but finally we had no other choice (other than shutting it down entirely).

BIG THANKS to Iconoclast and Ron and Chris B for their great work keeping this forum spam free.

Yes, posting participation has dropped significantly on this forum as a result, but visitors can still view the great info [THANK YOU EVERYONE!] without registering.