Identification help needed with an unusual Kynoch .455


#1

Can anyone help with identification of the following Kynoch 455.
The case has a semi-rim; upon which sits a brass ring that increases the rim diameter. The ring can be moved with a tug from a finger nail.

Could this be for line throwing, or projecting something?

Any help would be much appreciated.
Sam3


#2

Hi Sam,

It is a blank, but nobody seem to know for what purpose it was fitted with a brass ring. There are several variations in both .450 and .455.

Your example was loaded by IMI (Eley-Kynoch) using a case made by Norma.

Regards,

Fede

Edit: Here is an earlier discussion on the subject: Kynock 455


#3

Hi Fede,
Many thanks for the link…much appreciated and an interesting discussion.
My first thought was that this was a blank, however; would a blank require such a significant primer crimp?
Surely, such a primer crimp would not be added merely for decoration?
Regards,
Sam3


#4

I just had a call suggesting this might be a Ripping Link variation and HWS Volume 2 page 21 was mentioned. On the right, top side of the page it’s noted FA made long and short blanks were fitted with “steel clips” which partially fit around the extractor groove and served to adapt the US made versions to the British device.

Sam, my thoughts as to the excessive? primer crimps is that when used in a devise that might be cycled a primer falling out or moving back could easily cause a jam.


#5

I don’t know if this was any reason for the heavy primer crimps in
this blank cartridge, but I will mention that for cartridges, such as
blanks or primed cases, they don’t generate a lot of pressure, and
this can cause primer setback as the case is not held firmly against
the breech face.

I once need to make some dummies for a project, in .38 special. They
needed to have the spent primer in them. I had no problem removing
the bullet and powder, but figure the only way to have a spent primer in
them, conveniently, was to snap them in one of my revolvers. The first one
so “fired” lock up the cylinder tight as a drum. I finally figured out the cause,
extreme primer set back, and managed to free it easily by inserting a wood
dowel down the bore, into the cylinder and empty case, and tapping it with
a light plastic hammer, which reseated the primer and instantly freed the
cylinder.

It was the lack of set back when the case was fired that pushed the primer
partially out of the primer pocket, tight against the firing pin bushing, that locked
up the cylinder.

Blanks may not need those crimps - I just don’t know. Guess it would depend on
the amount of powder and pressure any specific blank had.

JLM


#6

From what I understand were not some Webley Revolvers were modified to fire .45 ACP cartridges using clips that snapped into the extractor groove. To do this they removed material from the rear of the cylinder to allow room for the clip. Once this was done they could not fire the original .455 cartridges anymore because of to much head space. Maybe this was intended to allow such a revolver to again fire .455 cartridges?
Just a guess.
Zac


#7

It was surplus revolvers entering the US of A that got shaved.
For pure civilian use i don’t think many blanks were needed?

What the “inventor” of the shaved cylinder failed to realise is that standard 45ACP pressures lies above Webley .455 proof loads, so many have split and died prematurely.


#8

This appears to be very close to the U.S. M7 Grenade launching auxiliary cartridge. Those were inserted into the muzzle end of the U.S. rifle grenade launchers before the rifle grenade was slipped onto the launcher. The wad end of the cartridge would be facing the chamber, and the base of the case would be against the back of the grenade tube. The flash from the regular grenade launching cartridge fired in the rifle chamber would ignited the powder in the auxiliary cartridge for added range.

There is no functional need for a primer in this application, and the U.S. cases were made from .45 ACP cases pulled from an early stage in the manufacturing process before a primer pocket was created. In this case, they may have used a primer, or inert cut heavily staked in place just to seal the base of the cartridge.

I know there are a lot of “Projector, (No. 4 Rifle) Mk 4 & 5” grenade launchers for the No. 4 Lee Enfield rifles based on Mecar designs, adopted starting around 1952. These are similar to the U.S. WW2 launchers M1 and M2 for the M1903 and M1917 rifles, and the M7, M7A1, M7A2 and M7A3 for the M1 Garand, and the M8 for the M1 Carbine.

This may be totally incorrect for the cartridge in question, but it sure looks like it would work in that role.


#9

Many thanks to everyone for their suggestions.
Any further thoughts; please don’t hesitate.
Regards,
Sam3