Italian flare gun cartridges?


#1

A frien of mine recently has given me this 2 cases and according to me they were used in some italian flare gun.Am I on the right way?

I give you some dimensional data

case#1 : neck diam, 26,56 mm, base diam.:28 mm,rim diam:31 mm,case lenght:95 mm.

case#2 : neck diam: 26,56 mm,base diam:28 mm,rim diam:30 mm (it’s knurled),case lenght: 81 mm

As you can see in the pictures the first one is headstamped : -orenz (lorenz?) brevettato TEMPINI. There are the lettrs “FG” and the number “11” too.It should had had a “screwed” primer - sorry I don’t know the english word for this kind of primer

The second one is headstamped : GIANNONE LC-913


#2

Pivi–Just to add to your already GREAT English, in the U.S. we would say “Screw-in” primer not “Screwed”. Keep up the great posts and questions.

I would agree that both cases are flares.


#3

Thank you Ron
However I can’t always write what I would like to say because my english is a bit “rusted”.I have learnt most of the technical english terms about ammo reading COTW so many times that it looks like now as a 300 years old book…I have some problems with the “in” and “on” words use and with the verbs too,but I have seen that every forum user is able to understand what I say…

Ciao,
Pivi


#4

italian flares
The rim has different shapes (marguerite, regular, or knurled) to show the loading (red, green , white)

jp


#5

Pivi, I think the larger round on the left is in fact a 1 Inch Aiming Rifle case. These were used in sub calibre inserts on large calibre naval guns for target practise.

The 1" Aiming rifle round was based on the earlier 1" Nordenfelt manually opertated machine gun round. However, this is not a Nordenfelt round as the case is threaded for a screw-in primer. Nordenfelt rounds only had conventional berdan type primers as far as I know.

Another indicator for it being the aiming rifle round and not a flare round are the three dot crimps about 1 inch (25mm) down from the case mouth that held the projectile in place. If you pick this case up, it should also feel far too heavy at the case head to be a flare round, as it was intended to be used at far higher pressures.

I didn’t even know Italy had made this calibre, I have only ever seen or heard of British examples. Shown below is a British made example of this case from my collection, next to a fired 1" Aiming rifle projectile and 7.62x51 Round for scale. I hope I have answered your question.


#6

Pivi, I think the larger round on the left is in fact a 1 Inch Aiming Rifle case. These were used in sub calibre inserts on large calibre naval guns for target practise. This would date from around 1900-1918.

The 1" Aiming rifle round was based on the earlier 1" Nordenfelt manually opertated machine gun round. However, this is not a Nordenfelt round as the case is threaded for a screw-in primer. Nordenfelt rounds only had conventional Berdan type primers as far as I know.


#7

Hi Falcon !
BOTH are Italian flares cases.
When they are not shot they look like that :


JP


#8

Okay, I stand corrected. I take it they were intended to be re-usable if they had screw-in primers. Do the ones you show have coloured paint on the case indicating the colour of light produced? Do these fit that Italian flarge gun you found at the Flea Market?


#9

Yes , it is the color of the flare because on these large shells the base is always normal (not marguerite or knurled)
On the shorter shells the base is depending of the loading.

I have still found nobody with a gun in better quality till now.
I wanted to take some pictures from friends who have some in USA (they don’t have internet!) but I think I will not be possible unfortunately for me to go to St Louis this year.
I have to make a new passport (the 4th one in three years!) just for entering USA !It cost a lot of meoney in France and all the paperwork is a pen in the ass( no smile on the picture, and so on).
This starts to be boring and I must not be the only one.
From the official statistics of US immigration : 30% drop of European visitors since 2001.
And despite that the number of terrorist arrested is constant !
Zero!!

Lol!

JP


#10

Pivi–I hope you did not take my correcting your use of “screwed” primer as a criticism. It was only meant to help you with your knowledge of the proper English words. Your English is far better than my Italian, which is non-existent!!


#11

Don’t worry Ron!!!
I try to learn some new word every day,so your notes will always be welcome.
Writing in this forum and reading other users’ posts helps me expanding my knowledge about ammunition.This is a great thing for any collector,I think

Thanks
Pivi