Would like info on 7.7 rimmed Japanese round. I know it was used by the Japanese Navy in their type 92 machine gun on some of their aircraft. Was 7.7 rimmed used for any other weapons? Robert
IJN (Imperial Japanese Navy) adopted the .303 British cartridge IN THE LATE 1920S (27-29) for use in their own copies of the British Lewis Gun (Types 87 and 92) and the Vickers Aircraft Model (T89)
for use in Naval aircraft ( Carrier Fighters etc, and Floatplanes of all types.) and Patrol Boats etc. The cartridge design was finalised on “Type 92”. with a loading (in Nitrocellulose) very close to the ballistic parameters of the Original .303 British Mark VII. The two cartridges are Interchangeable. Very early Production for the Navy was done at the Tokyo Army Ammunition Plant in the late 1920s, but regular Production was done by the Three Naval Dockyards, along with all the other Ammunition requirements of the Navy (Cannon, AA and Large calibre).
In keeping with IJN practice, all “T92” ammo was Headstamped, until late in the war. (7.7 98-III, Kana Mark of Naval depot).
Ammunition was supplied in Boxes of 50 rounds for the Lewis Gun Use, and Belts ( Prideaux Links, copies of British) for the Vickers Aircraft Guns.
After the Fall of Singapore and Hong Kong, the IJN took a lot of British/Empire-Made .303 ammo into service, as well as using the Vickers Ground Guns and Lewis Guns in the IJN Marines units, and on small craft, to supplement the IJN’s own production.
More detail on headstamps, etc can be found in Elks’ “Japanese Ammunition” Handbooks.
It may be worth noting that other nations also used the .303 cartridge under the 7.7mm designation, as with the IJN usually for use with Vickers or Lewis aircraft guns.
The Italian Air Force also retained the use of the 7.7 x 56R / .303 ammo in their own Breda-SAFAT and Scotti MGs.
The semi-rimmed 7.7 x 58SR and the rimless 7.7 x 58 version were of course quite different, and used by the Japanese Army.
Thanks for the info what I have is marked E 1-11 7.7 Made by the Yokosuka naval arsenal 1941 second quarter. The story that came with the 7.7 is that it was on a Japanese airplane that crashed north of Los Angeles. The plane was found in a canyon north of Saugus in the 1950s. The Japanese had float plane on submarines off the coast of LA in the early part of the war. I have been looking a E 9 W1 float plane. The only air raid I can find is the 1942 February 24 around the Los Angeles area. Robert
Some pictures of machine gun and different cartridges:
Type 92 Japanese Machine Gun.
7.7 Type 92, Tracer with nickel plated projectile and green case mouth sealer.
7.7 Type 92, Armor-Piercing with Black case mouth sealer
7.7 Type 92, Regular Ball with red case mouth sealer.
7.7 Type 92, Regular Ball with red case mouth sealer and Green Primer, 1942 to 1944 production
I think there may be some confusion here…
The 7.7mm Type 92 Navy machine gun was an aircraft gun based on the Lewis LMG, and firing the rimmed 7.7mm ammunition (basically, the .303).
The 7.7mm Type 92 Army machine gun was entirely different and its ammunition was a semi-rimless or rimless type.
It’s the Army gun and ammo shown above, not the Navy one.