Kynoch 9mmP production in the 1930s


#1

Kynoch produced headstamps with just K and a two digit date with dates of 20, 21, 22 and 23. There is an old Eley drawing that implies from 1920 for a 9mmP cartridge for a Vickers contract (for the Vickers Luger being supplied to the Dutch). Eley became a division of Kynoch in 1919 and I have assumed that Kynoch took over the contract, or Eley produced it with a Kynoch headstamp. I have Kynoch boxes for the Dutch dated 1922 and 1923. They are interesting because they are 50 round boxes but labeled for 48 cartridges.

Does anyone have label photos from 1920 or 1921???

I was surprised to find these same K22 headstamped rounds in Kynoch commercial boxes dated as late as 1932, and in Dominion boxes (Dominion first offered 9mmP in their 1935 catalog). This is particularly interesting since Kynoch 1923 production for the Dutch is more common than the 1922 boxes, and FN also produced rounds packed for the Dutch in 1922 (FN production appears limited to 1921 and 1922, and 21 dates specimens are very difficult. I have only documented 1922 dated boxes with these rounds).

Given that Kynoch production ended with the 1923 dated ammunition, why is it the 1922 dated ammunition that Kynoch is selling into the early, perhaps mid-1930s? Did the Dutch prefer the FN 1922 production and reject the Kynoch 1922 production??? If so, why did they come back to Kynoch in 1923 and not buy any ammo from FN??? Did the Dutch return the K 22 ammunition to Kynoch, perhaps in the 1930s for some reason???

If I had opened the Kynoch and Dominion commercial boxes and found K 23 headstamped ammunition I would have had no questions and assumed they continued production for the commercial market and were still selling this ammo 10 to 15 years later.

Does anyone out there have the rest of this story that can explain why it is K 22 headstamped ammunition and not K 23 in the commerical boxes from the 1930s???

Any help/comments appreciated.


Post WWI 9 para german ctges
#2

Lew: A couple of things that are no better than tangential to your question, but may help in some manner: first, the headstamp design is itself in the Dutch pattern, with the date at 12 and the maker’s code at 6. Another thought is that FN in 1922, at least, made 6.5 m/m rifle ammunition (headstamp 22 over FN) for the KNIL in the Indies. This FN contract for rifle ammunition or components seems to have been a one-time or limited-time activity.
Another oddment, just found in the Wikipedia, is a comment that in the 1920s Eley and Fabrique Nationale were commercially allied. This last bit was new to me, but maybe someone on the forum might be able to coax these bits into assisting you in your question. Hope so, JG


#3

Hi Lew

I don’t have the answer to your questions, but will look through my Eley and Kynoch drawings later to see if there is any light to be shed.

It will have to wait until next week though as I am going to hospital later today for about four days.

Regards
Tony


#4

Hi Lew

I made it back home!

I have the Eley sketch you refer to, and I suspect you also have the drawings below, but I have posted them for every one’s benefit.

It is interesting that the 1932 drawing still shows the two position “K and date” headstamp from the 1920s.

Other than that, i have not found anything to answer your question.

Cheers
Tony


#5

Tony, Many thanks!!! I had one of these drawings, but not the other with the 1932 date and the Vicker’s Contract style headstamp. Makes one suspect that Kynoch may have produced the 22 K headstamped cartridges into the 1930s. I wonder why they would do that???

Great info. Thanks.


#6

That was exactly my thought Lew.

Perhaps either Kynoch continued to produce “K 22” cases or had a large stock of dated cases that they used up by selling to Dominion in the 1930s.

Anyway, I will e-mail you a high res. scan of that drawing.

Regards
Tony