M-1 Garand clips


#1

I just acquired a couple of dozen more M-1 garand clips, some with markings unfamiliar to me. I checked the web for identification, so now I know what I have. The question remains, which ones are rare, special or otherwise rare enough to hang on to? Is even the most rare one only worth a few dollars? I know some of these were made in the tens of millions or more, but surely some have collector value.

AKMS


#2

AKMS: I can’t answer your question in detail, but there is an early M1 clip, made in the mid-1930s, that should be a legitimate rarity. This one has horizontal corrugations on the back instead of the semicircular type. I’ve never handled one, but it’s pictured in Pyle’s gas trap M1 book. Then there are the earlier Garand clips: single column .30 caliber, 10-round double column for the .276, etc. Those, as an old friend used to say, “don’t show much.” JG


#3

Another collector asked me a few days ago - what are the 10 round .276 clips worth? I had no idea. Maybe he is reading this, so, does anyone know?

Ray


#4

The problem with putting a value on clips is that there is a very small market for most of them. It took me a long time to find a Garand one marked ‘S’ made by Stanley Works and an even longer time to find one marked ‘HA’ made by Haerens Ammunitionsarsenale but now I have them I’m not really looking for a duplicate of either. When I was still looking for them I was prepared to spend a bit, the ‘S’ cost me around $15 US which, apart from the early, experimental ones, is probably about the top of the market.

Apart from the early ones I don’t suppose any Garand clip is ‘scarce’, after all they were mostly made in vast quantities. At the moment I’d like to find one marked ‘TF&S’ by Thomas French & Sons or one by Danly but I don’t think I’d commit a lot of cash to buying one because there will be another one along at some point.

By and large, a clip full of ammunition is worth roughly what the cartridges are worth. The clip is a nice extra but doesn’t have a lot of value in itself. This is a generalisation as some clips are very hard to find but it definitely applies in most cases.

Speaking as a confirmed collector of all types of clips I work on this principle; When you want 'em, they’re scarce. When you’ve got 'em, you stop looking and keep your eyes open for something else.


#5

Well, said Enfield. I’m not a clip collector per-say, but I am curious as to thier relative value/scarcity. I’m a shooter mostly and if the clip works, that is what is most important to me. I’d just hate to be using a clip that is a real gem to a collector! Can I contact you with a list of what I have to get some idea if any are interesting or not?

AKMS


#6

Why not publish the list here on the Forum? Chargers have become a major topic on this Forum, rightfully so. they are an important part of the firearm/ammunition-feeding equation. It would be interesting to see a list of the markings of Garand clips, and perhaps give the opportunity to add to the list.


#7

I believe there was an article in the Garand Collectors Association Journal on clip markings.

My eyes glazed over before I could read it, but as I recall there were a lot of them. And that was just the common 8 round variety!


#8

John

Can you please scan it or mail me the article out of that Journal
or better place it on the IAA forum.

regards
gyrojet


#9

All additions and corrections gratefully received


#10

Are there known date ranges for these manufacturers? In my 40 odd collection of clips, the BRW (1-6) clips are the most common, but where do the following fit in on the rarity scale?

DAQ
DAQ.
NW
SA (unmarked)
SA (no lines, large letters)
SA (one line)
SA (two lines)
IS1 (also a variation without serifs on the number 1, looks like “ISI”)
BLM
( )

I also have unmarked clips that came from Denmark that look just like the unmarked Springfield clips. Are these Danish made?

AKMS


#11

Why did the UK manufacture Garand clips?


#12

To use in the lend lease Garands.

Ray


#13

[quote=“Ray Meketa”]To use in the lend lease Garands.

Ray[/quote]

Ray,

Were any Garand rifles included in the Lend-lease arrangements?? I know that there were Model 1917 rifles and US manufactured .303" Lee-Enfields but this is the first mention that I have seen of Garands. I assumed that the UK made clips were post-war for export. The Garand was never, as far as I know, a UK service rifle.

gravelbelly


#14

I can’t speak for England, but about 35 years ago, perhaps more, our store was buying very nice M1 Garand Rifles out of Canada. I don’t know when they went there originally, but I suspect they may have been for the Korean War, not WWII. I could be totally wrong about that. I will try to research it if if can find time today. I have a number of books on the Garand, just about my favorite modern rifle.


#15

A substantial quantity of ex-British M1 rifles found their way to the U.S. in the early to mid-1960s. I don’t know if they were formally part of the Lend-Lease program or not, but most were early WW.2 standard production U.S. rifles, modified only by a red band painted around the upper handguard and post-1945 British commercial proofing. Bruce Canfield and others have written pretty extensively on these rifles, practically the only surviving early production specimens in as-produced condition. JG


#16

Gill et al - You are correct. The rifles were supplied to England under Lend-Lease and “related programs” (according to Canfield - perhaps there were some actual purchases as well) in late 1941 and 1942, The deliveries were kept secret for the most part, as the U.S. military at that time was short of small arms and the American Public, especially before Pearl Harbor, probably would not have been too happy, as Canfield points out, to hear that the brand new U.S. Service Rifle, in very short supply to U.S. Forces, were being shipped overseas.

As Gill pointed out, they were marked in England with a red band painted around the front handguard to signify that they were a different caliber than the standard .303" cartridge, and evidently the number “.30” was painted on many as well. Most of these Lend-Lease weapons were issued to the home guard and few, if any, saw service with British troops abroad. They bear British proof marks, but these were not applied at the time of delivery from the U.S., but rather pursuant to British law, the guns were proofed before being exported back to the United States, with the marks applied at that time.

I could find nothing about the Canadian rifles, but my impression was that most showed rebuilding - parts of post-WWII design, and they may have been sent for use by the Canadian contingent of the UN Forces in Korea. I don’t know how many troops went from Canada, or what weapons they used, in Korea. I know that the Brits used their own Rifles Number 4, as well as the usual assortment of Stens, Brens, etc.

The only Canadian use of the Garand of which I am aware was with the joint US/Canada Mountain Brigade, the name of which escapes me right now, that
was formed during WWII. The Canadians trained with the US, wore the same battle dress as the US troops, and used US weapons. I don’t know if they took the rifles back to Canada when the unit was disbanded or not, but I tend to doubt it.

Regarding the shipment of U.S. Arms to allies at the time the US was short, I have a Remington Model 1903 “Springfield” rifle of the earliest configuration, barrel-date 11-41 and serial number in the high 7000 series of Remington’s numbers (30078XX) that was sent to New Zealand, probably soon after or just before Pearl Harbor, and remained there. Its 95% condition and total lack of any alterations or refinishing, other than “NZ^D” and a number stamped in the left side of the butt stock, indicate it probably was never used or even issued.

Reference: “Bruce N. Canfield’s Complete Guide to the M21 Garand and M1 Carbine,” page 73.


#17

The British govt considered adopting the Garand as it’s service rifle during WWII, based on the experience with the lend lease rifles. It didn’t happen, of course, for whatever the reasons. I don’t know what the reasons were but I’d guess they were largely political.

Ray


#18

The Canadians must have used the Garand to some extent since we know of Dominion maked clips, unless this was ammunition made for US govt. contracts.

AKMS


#19

In the late 40s Canada considered adopting the US 30 cal weapons family. The 25th Brigade destined for Korea in 1950 trained on US weapons until it was decided to attach them to the Commonwealth Div. The RCAF in Europe used the M1 extensively in the 50s.


#20

Great List! thanks

I’d like to add “AMP 1” and “AMP 3”

My copy of Mil-STD-1461D dated 21 April 1980 lists AMP as:
APCO MOSSBERG Co. of Attleboro MA