Magsafe agent loads?

I have heard some, and seen some of the so called Magsafe “Agent” loads, and have also heard that they packed enough punch to penetrate level II kevlar, and still fragment after penetration to incapacitate. Is this bunk, or does anyone know anything more. I have seen this website, which has allot of info, and a copy of a magazine article, but I got that “too good to be true” feeling after reading it. … e_ammo.htm

Regarding Magsafe’s abilities as a self-defense load, each to his own, and each to decide for himself if they want to use this kind of ammunition.

Regarding the so-called Strasbourg tests, it is the opinion of most professionals involved with Wound Ballistics that I have met or corresponded with (I don’t count popular gun press writers as professionals, by the way, nor myself, of course) believe that this whole thing was a hoax. All copies of the results that I am aware of came from the same source, including my own, and the source had “a horse in the race.”

They did not take place in Strasbourg, France, and I have not met or heard of a criminalist with any major European Police Agency that knows anything about these tests. They could not have been performed without the knowledge of authority in any country, especially with the large number of live animals supposedly shot in the tests. Further, the papers relating to the tests show not one single name of a technician, agency, etc. involved with the tests. Totally anonymous and therefore totally unverifiable. Years later, we still have not heard of one single person who had a part in these so called tests. Only some writers of the Popular Press seem to take these tests on faith, without offering one shred of evidence that they ever took place, other than “no one could write that report unless the tests did take place,” which of course, is a lot of bunk.

If anyone has specific, accurate and verifiable information about any tests similar or the same having ever been conducted with these modern “wonder cartridges” I would love to get the information.

Hi John
I know nothing about Magsafe tests.
Legally in France you need no authorisation to do such tests.
But if the SPA (animals protective society) hears about that, they will make a fuss !!

I am not writting about the tests of Magsafe (I think like you it is not true) but just to inform you that I have seen , not a too long time ago (3 or 4 years), similar tests made by an american company making ctges.
The tests were made on big pigs with everytime an authopsy.
When I said “I saw”, it means I saw the videos about experiments with different calibers (about 6) .
The result of these ammunitions was pretty impressive

KD AGENT LOADS as loaded by Joe Zambone were the real deal and worked better than glaser black MV loads.I worked with Joe & Kay on the KD loads in 40s&w. Joe did a bit of bait and switch…some KD loads were not loaded with the steel shot.

FWIW…Joe has long passed and sold magsafe to a guy in florida many years ago…Joes hand loaded rounds are a world apart from the “new magsafe” loadings.Some of Joes custom powder mixes were down right scary but they worked.

I am NOT a fan of any pre frag round for SD or police work.

Did you know an “Al” who was suppose to have worked with Joe Z?

Did MagSafe make up any of this “special” ammo-not the stuff they sold commercially-in 9mmP. Any idea who may have some of it???

I have 18 different MagSafe 9mmP in the collection with all kinds of names and weights written on them and no idea what they really were suppose to be. None are magnetic. Where would I find any information on them.

Any info would be appreciated.

Cheers, Lew

Lew - Magsafe rounds are not always easy to identify once out of the package. Initially, Joe used to put different tip colors on each load, and the bullet shapes were sometimes different. Later on, they started to all have a clear resin tip fill and became more difficult to determine as to laod.

I have a lot of Magsafe Literature, and a lot of packages. I have 40 different Magsafe 9mm in my collection, although not all are different loads. Maybe after St. Louis I can help you sort yours out a little. I would need to know the cartridge weights, and as good a description of the bullet as you can made (ogive, apparent color of the plastic-resin tip fillers, etc.) No guarantee how much I will be able to help you. Some loads are not much different from others, involving, I am sure, just velocities rather than bullet design. those I probably will not be able to identify, since I don’t have his loading data.

Some of mine were not made in quantity. From time to time, Joe would send me down rounds he had fooled around with. He once said I had a better Magsafe collection than he did, because he was a merchant of ammunition, not a collector.