Just read a reliable report of some commercial boxes of Prvi Partisan .32 ACP ammo with mixed “nny” and “IK” headstamps! The full Igman headstamp was “IK 03”. Very interesting, gotta find one of those! Are the two factories now working together?
I would think not. I recall there were some serious issues between the Bosnians and Serbs in that area not too long ago?
True, but can you explain this? Perhaps “business is business”?
Serbia is today an aknowledged country within Europe and is also supplying ammunition components to at least Slovenia (which is a former Yugoslav republic). I would not be surprised if this would go for other former republics as well.
“IK 03” on a .32 ACP sounds intertesting.
…I misread the title of this thread … " Marriage of PIVI and Igman???" :|
Just back from my weekly shooting therapy with Dave S. He couldn’t hit crap today;)
Anyway, he pulled out a box of Prvi (nny) .380 he got yesterday and…you guessed it…headstamp is IK 03 9x17.
I’ll add a pic of the headstamp later.
Thanks for sharing just how bad I was today :-( I blame it on jet lag :-) I’ll post headstamp and box shortly.
Good, my camera batts are dead.
Box plus headstamp
Dave - What is the “Country of Origin” on the box label? It should read Bosnia-Herzogovina" if it is truthful.
Box clearly states “Made in Serbia” !!!
Dave - thanks. Interesting. Unless these were loaded at Prvi Partizan in Serbia, even if the two companies have somehow merged, that is a false declaration of the country of origin. The Igman factory is in Bosnia. If the cartridges were loaded by Prvi Partizan, I suppose they could use the “Made in Serbia” declaration legally. Probably we will never know.
It would be interesting to explore the relationship between the two companies, and see if the Igman Factory in Bosnia is still operating. I will try to do that. One of our number was employed recently by Igamn, here in the US, and perhaps he will have some information. I checked the Prvi Partizan website and unless I missed it, which is possible, there was no mention of Igman or any relationship with them.
For some reason, I could not bring up a site for Igman. I will try that again later, also.
I can’t recall another instance where the ammunition of one factory was being sold in boxes and with the country of origin marking of another factory, even in the long-time relationship of companies like RWS and Geco (Dynamit Nobel A.-G.) before WWII. Of course today, these European companies are being absorbed by other corporations at an unprecendented rate, to the point where there actually are only a few ammunition COMPANIES left, although there are more factories, and brand names than companies. Any relationship between Prvi Partizan and Igman is astonishing considering the level of hatred that existed between the two former elements of Tito’s Yugoslavia, and the atrocities committed by both sides during the last Balkans war.
I have revisited the Prvi Partrizan and Igman websites. There is no mention on either of any connections between the two companies. Further, it was interesting to note that the only pistol caliber Igman shows in manufacture by them is the 9mm Parabellum. If you were to go by their website, they do not manufacture the .380 or .32 auto cartridges at all. Hmmmmm!
I am awaiting more information from other sources.
Could be Igman only made the cases.
Aggressive & Lush buying markets make strange bedfellows. I am guessing that the recent very high-demand for .380acp may have something to do with this remarkable situation. I do know that just a few weeks ago when AIMsurplus.com received a shipment of Prvi .380 and listed it on their site at a decent price, the ammo completely sold out in 1 day. That would have been like 50,000-100,000 rds if it is anything like their usual shipments.
Possible, but my initial posting on this was for .32ACP. Could be they did a deal on a few different hot calibers.
The stuff that AIM received all at once a few weeks ago was .32acp, .380acp and some .38spl LRN from Prvi. They still have a bit of the .38
Just out of curiosity, I asked my nephew about this issue. He is currently completing a masters’ program in foreign affairs and is pretty conversant on the subject. In his opinion, Igman and Prvi would very likely put aside past (ethnic/political/etc…) differences in the pursuit of the allmighty dollar…business is business.
AKMS - that’s pretty clearly the case. Nothing really new about that in business or politics. Perhaps that’s a good thing.
It is interesting that none of Igman’s catalogs that i have show them manufacturing either the .32 or .380 Auto caliber, including their current on-line catalog. Also, despite being a very current importation, the Igman cases (and perhaps the ammunition) in the Prvi Partizan boxes are six years old! That’s a long gap from maker to market. The headstamp, too, is more military or police contract-style than commercial. Perhaps surplus ammunition reboxed at Prvi Partizan for commercial sale?
A couple (or more thoughts)
First, these are old cases-produced in 2003. I have seen the IK 03 9x19 hst. These were probably an Igman contract for someone since they are dated it may have been a police contract or at least government. Since Igman has not been traditionally a producer of 32ACP and 380, they may have bought the cases from PP. In the rush to produce ammo, PP could be loading their old cases that are production overrun from other contracts.
Alternatively, these could have been production overrun at Igman and bought by PP.
I have ordered a couple of boxes of PP 9x19 (backordered) just in case it comes in wiht IK 03 headstamps also!!! If not it goes out the barrel of a gun.
We all know that the headstamp says little about who loaded the cases anymore (Geco, and HP both loaded by RUAG and lots more examples).
There are other possibilities, but the fact that the cases are dated six years ago indicates they were probably production overrun in somebody’s stocks and just got loaded to satisfy the US demand.