Mauser cartridges with wooden bullets, are they reloads?

I bought this at a local gun store. I thought they might be factory, but the headstamps are all different. The clip is marked P 25.

What’s up with the black primers and what do the 8,9, and 10 mean on the last three? I know the one with the eagle is Polish. The P316 is WW2 German.

Any more info I could get about these would be great.

Also, the bullets themselves measure .310.

The wooden bullets certainly look the same as the wooden bullet blanks that I have. The first case appears to have been reloaded based on the primer and crimp marks.

The German headstamp include factory where the case was loaded, the case material, year of loading and either the month of loading or the lot number. I think the lot number was introduced in the mid 1920s but don’t quote me on that. I’m no expert on these.

I believe the first HS is as follows:
P = Polte
S* = Brass (* indicates the brass was recycled).
57 = Lot number
36 = 1936

I’m unsure of the others, especially the “I07” code on the last three.

A combination of a roman numeral (I to XXII) for the steel mill supplying the basic case-metal, a lower-case letter for the plating agency and an arabic numeral (1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 15 or 17) for the steel-analysis, identifies a copper-plated steel case

On your case(s)

I o 1

I = steel mill : Friedrich Krupp A.G., Stahlwerk, Maschinenfabrik, Thomaestr. 100, Essen
o = plating agency : Eduard Hueck Metallwarenfabrik, Lüdenscheid, Westfalen
1 = steel analysis: C : 0,15 - 0,22 % / Mn : 0,4 % / Si : 0,12 % / P : 0,03 % / S : 0,03 %

P316 is the manufacturer of the case: Westfälische Metallindustrie A.G., Lippstadt, Westfalen

and 8 9 and 10 are the Lotnumbers

1 Like

Hi,
I have absolutely no knowledge about any kind of ammunition outside of shotshells.
But always interested in learning.
You give the numbers 1 to 17 as being an ID of the steel analysis.
Why are there no numbers 5, 7, 13, 14 and 16??

Regards rené

Thank you much. It’s good to know that the bullets themselves probably weren’t made in someone’s garage if they match some you have.

I appreciate the help. That’s a lot of info just from the few numbers and letters available.

René,

The numbers i gave were the “observed” ones. not saying that the others do not exist.
Also, most of the steel analysis codes have an unknown composition.
I only know the composition of 1 - 2 and 17

1 = C : 0,15 - 0,22 % / Mn : 0,4 % / Si : 0,12 % / P : 0,03 % / S : 0,03 %
2 = C : 0,08 - 0,12 % / Mn : 0,4 % / Si : 0,12 % / P : 0,03 % / S : 0,03 %
17 = C : 0,17 - 0,22 % / Mn : 0,4 % / Al : 0,1 % / P : 0,03 % / S : 0,03 %
Al : aluminum ; C : carbon ; Mn : manganese ; P : phosphorus ; S : sulphur ; Si : silicon

Thank you very much for the explanation!

Regards rené

In Germany a blank 33 did not have a primer crimp.
They can have a primer crimp when the cases had a bad quality so they could not use them for ball loads. Could you please show the bullet from the Polte load?

@ Mayhem. The first known “lot” was made in November 1923.
It was not a lot but the month of producing.
This changed in 1926. In this year the old stock of WW1 cups went to his end and they start making brass again with 72% copper instead 67%. A marking on the 72% cases is the star behind the “S”. This has nothing to do with “recycled” brass.

If the wooden bullet is the same as the other, the Polish blank was probably made under German occupation in Poland.

kam%2041-8%20Platz%2033%20(p)

The P316 were made of so called left over’s. If a lot was produced always more cases were made than used. They were put together and were loaded as a blank 33 (Platzpatrone 33).
Your P316 cartridges have a Primer 30 black, and no primer crimps.

The “107” is Io1 as orpheus72 explained.
@ orpheus72, I don’t know where you get the steel analyses, but for the three you mentioned they are;

1 = C 0,19 - 0,24 %,Cu 0,25, Mn 0,6%, Si 0,12%, P 0,03%, S 0,035%
2 = C 0,08 - 0,12 %,Cu 0,25, Mn 0,6 - 08 %, Si 0,15%, P 0,02%, S 0,025%
17 = C 0,17 . 0,22% Al 0,1% other like #1

It is not so important.

Best regards

Thanks for the correction on the S* - I guess you can’t believe everything you read on the internet…

I believe a 7.9 ‘recycled’ case, for a time had a thin knurled ring to note it’s re-use.

Pete, you are right.
It was done before 1918 in Bavarian state arsenals.
They reloaded ball cartridges for practice only.

I am sorry. I don’t have a better example.

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I an going to ask an obvious question because I have a brain lock:
I know that I know what it is, but recall is not functioning!

Picture No. 2, ‘67, 39, N’, what is the stamp at 12 o’clock?
Imperial German?

Jack, that is the Polish eagle (coat of arms).

Thanks for the correction Dutch !
I got those numbers somewhere online, not sure when/where, but a long time ago.
Glad to have the correct analysis numbers now.

Geert.

This is the bullet in the Polte load…

Polish load…

P316 in order from L to R…8,9,10…
image

This is the clip they were loaded in…for reference…

I just want to thank everyone for the wealth of information you’ve given me. It prompted me to do some more web research on my own.

My last question/comment, and it may be a stupid one… What would these cartridges have been used for exactly? Like drill/loading training or dry fire trading or something completely different.

Lastly, could this whole setup have been put together in WWII Germany or are these some parts sold off to other countries after the fact.

Should the clip be left with th rounds as a “unit” or display the rounds separate and sell/display somewhere else the clip.

Again, thank you for the discussion.

@ Squeaker, There are no stupid questions, only stupid answers.

The P25 clip was made by Metallwarenfabrik Treuenbritzen G.m.b.H., Plant Sebaldushof.

The official name of this cartridge is Platzpatrone 33.
It was used to make realistic sounds in a manoeuvre. Also a blank.
The Platzpatrone 33 was made for the German Army until the end of WW2.

It was not used for loading/unloading exercises. There for the Germans used a special Exerzier Patrone.

After the war other country’s used old cases to make blanks of them. I think your Polte round is one of them. The wooden bullet is a little different as the other you showed.
From the time, the clip belongs to the cartridges.

Rgds

Looks like the questions have been answered in detail. Yes these are platzpatronen 33 blanks. Loaded in used cases. May see WW1 and foreign (Non German) cases (Polish Czech etc)and any variety of matrerial brass cu washed steel and lacuered steel. I seen alarge assortment of cases even some rare test cases reused for blanks! The Boxes are interesting and not as common as ball. Nice find !